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Strategies & Market Trends : Zeev's Turnips - No Politics -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: longdong_63 who wrote (51038)4/13/2002 7:25:10 PM
From: augieboo  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 99280
 
Am I too hairy and need my claws trimmed?

I think perhaps just a little off the ends. <g>

I agree that all of the factors you listed are at least worrisome, and if they all were to hit, full-force, at once, we'd be in deep doo-doo, (as Bush Sr. allegedly says), but I just don't see it happening in that way.

On the other hand, the S&P 500 is still at what, three to five times its historical PE? "The bubble," IMHO, is still with us, and will need to be corrected out of all the markets. But, I think this will happen over time -- two, three, maybe as long as five years.

During that time I think that the markets will go up and down and up and down, but without really going anywhere. Instead, I think the indexes will swing back and forth through broad ranges -- say 1000 to 3000 on the NAZ and 7000 to 12000 on the DOW -- ending up about where we started. During that time, the cumulative effects of growth will deflate the bubble(s).

Not that it will be gentle or pretty -- far from it.

I think we'll see a series of phony "recoveries" based on B.S. interpretations of dubious economic data. Then, when enough of the shorts are sucked into the "new bull," (or at least "sustainable rally"), the Boyz will "discover" something really nasty which will bring it all back down again.

To see what I'm talking about, just consider this last quarter. How long has it been now since "they" announced that everything was rosy because we hadn't really even had a recession, and corporate earnings expectations were now so low that nobody could possibly miss, etc. A few weeks at most, right?

Then what happened? "They" figured out that pro-forma earnings are B.S.? He!!, I can remember Mish bellowing about that crappola on the FOOL back when the NAZ was still above 4000! And the big boys just figured it out?

What else happened? Oops! Looks like those "can't miss" earnings numbers can be missed after all! Gee, how could that happen? Could it have something to do with the fact that the corporate world overspent on capital improvements, buyouts, takeovers, acquisitions, etc., etc., etc., manyfold over the past few years?

In short, all of the potential horrors you mention -- and many more neither of us have contemplated -- are in the BOYZ's tool box, waiting to be pulled out at the right, i.e., most profitable for the BOYZ, moment.

But, with all that said, two facts keep me from worrying too much.

First, the BOYZ won't let things run too far, too fast, because that is untidy, and untidiness tends to confuse their A.I. buy-sell programs. (Bad for the bottom line, don't you know.)

Second, whichever way the markets go, there will be a trend -- a "channel" if you will -- and good old HAL will keep us updated on which way it is pointing.

augieboo

Disclaimers: All of the above is based on rank speculation and cynicism. Your mileage may vary. Do your own TA and DD. Drinking too much soda may make you fat and rot your teeth. The surgeon general has determined that cigarette smoking will most likely kill you one day, and, in the mean time, it will make you a social pariah if you live west of the Rockies.



To: longdong_63 who wrote (51038)4/13/2002 9:06:31 PM
From: Jeff  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 99280
 
you are right on bud...

but remember...don't try to over analyze this thing....thats the biggest mistakes traders and investors make....

to put it in simple terms...

" honesty " will bring these markets down.....

thats right....the first warning shots are being fired...IBM, GE and other big boys missing for the first time in years....

why...simple...since enron....they all got the "truth" scared into them now....

honesty will show they aren't worth what they trade at now...

investors now see the truth....they want out.....market goes down....

honesty....

merrill lynch caught red-handed in e-mails how they were pushing self-proclaimed garbage at inflated prices to the public.....

anybody with half a brain knows all the big houses do the same thing...but now....the naive public little mom and pop who believe everything they are told...finally realize they were playing with crooks.....

guess what.... the crap is going to be hitting the fan real fast on the " boyz"....as investors or " sheep" are now onto them....they pull out....

market goes down....

we... as folks in the market daily already knew all this stuff was going on....and accept it...and trade around it....but it takes the general public time to figure these things out.....

but as the news starts getting filled with more big "safe" companies showing weakness from the "truth" bug.....and more merril lynch types get exposed......

little J6P....mom and pops everywhere are going to wake up to the real world of wall street...and not like it one little bit.....

yup....IBM GE...early warning shots are fired.....those who heed the warning...will still have money when this bottoms out much lower.....

those who don't.....will be bagholders....toasted.

IBM broke the september low when dow was 8200....dow is still 10000 plus......a newby trader can figure out that IBM won't be in the 80's when dow is 8200 again.....

that goes for all stocks breaking those sept lows and making new lows at these higher levels.....its all an early warning of things to come....

where i am from....ice fishing is a big winter sport....some of the best times are in the spring when the temps heat up....but the lake is still froze solid....its a great time....but very dangerous....as ice on lakes is always dangerous....

the market is like that ice....very dangerous....and the mood of the bulls is like those nice warm temps....they feel good and want back in as they have been through a long cold winter of 2 years of the bear market....

now the wise ice fisherman knows that eventhough it feels great to get on that ice with the feel good temps....he's wise enough to know to look for the " early " warning signs the ice is melting...

and that warning sign is....the ice starts melting at the shores edges....just before it " consumes" the ice on the entire lake as the " meltdown " soon becomes very rapid after those first early signs....

enron...IBM...GE...merrill lynch.....the " ice is melting at the shore".....and the " wise" know what happens after that.....

everybody has an opinion....and thats mine.