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To: Poet who wrote (9013)	4/15/2002 12:48:30 PM
From: one_less	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

"And can you see anything positive coming from comparing one's social group against another? I can." Years ago when I was doing educational research I came to this conclusion. Example: You take a child who is a below average reader and compare him to the norm. The results are that he is in the 15 or 20% group. You throw all kinds of programs and instruction at him and he makes progress over time all the way to the fourtieth percentile (close enough to hang with the average kids). He is still seen by himself and others as below the norm. He eventually loses all incentive to keep trying. Likewise when you compare siblings or other close associates against some norm it is almost always destructive, as it involves jealousies. On the other hand you can set the criterian for growth as so much increased vocab and word attack or speed or something and help him accomplish the criterian. As he sees himself getting closer and closer or surpassing his criterian based goal his confidence and motivation grow; and his little face begins to glow. Anything can be compared to a criterian for improvement. You find little disagreement until you associate an individual or group with the negative and an opposing group as the norm and the positive. "And can you see anything positive coming from comparing one's social group against another? I can." There are short term gains that can be accomplished by pitting groups against each other as long as the goal of the two groups is to move toward a superordinate criterian that they both recognize. When the condition lasts longer than a short term situation we get something like the irresolvable disfunction of the repubs and the dems during the last year of the clinton administration. Everyone was pretty much wallowing and hoping they could survive to the next administration. Just imagine what it would have been like if we didn't have automatic new administrations every four to eight years. I was not crazy about LBJ but the smartest thing he ever did was decline to run for a second term of presidency.

To: Poet who wrote (9013)	4/15/2002 1:47:38 PM
From: Lazarus_Long	Respond to of 21057

It seems to me that the indignation WRT Hillary Rodham Clinton falls more squarely on the shoulders of her detractors, who crowed at her failure to institute health care reform, Her execution was idiotically stupid. She forgot she was not Empress, but First Lady. For a supposed professional, her performance was pathetic. who failed to empathize with her position as the spurned spouse of a man who couldn't seem to keep his willy zipped, She originally presented herself as the liberated feminist who would take no s&t. Then she started playing "Stand By Your Man"- -in precisely those circumstances where a great many of her unliberated sisthren would walk out the door. The contrast was, ah, amusing. and who jeered at her successful bid as senator to New York.* That's called politics, madam.