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To: TimF who wrote (11477)	5/1/2002 12:45:43 PM
From: Poet	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

How many times do you have to post that you don't like the word 'homophobia"? We get it already.

To: TimF who wrote (11477)	5/2/2002 6:10:44 AM
From: Solon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

"The word is intentionally coined to imply that fear is always the root. People may hate for other reasons besides fear" LOL! I really have very little sympathy for your position that the word confuses you. As a mater of fact, after walking to the kitchen for a cup of coffee, and reflecting deeply on the matter while I stirred in the cream, I find that I have absolutely NO sympathy for your despair. It seems to me that your behaviour around this issue has been refractory and picayune. I have not seen any definition posted here that was not substantially or wholly like Webster's definition: "irrational fear of, aversion to, or discrimination against homosexuality or homosexuals". If one does find a dictionary definition that is different in a meaningful way, it would only imply an evolving meaning--which words do undergo, especially in infancy. But I have not seen a single definition of homophobia which leaves the meaning unclear or questionable. As to your sense of helplessness that you cannot find words to describe people who hate without actually having an unconscious irrational fear...you surely are not trying very hard. There are myriad words to describe irrational hatred of people. There are people who irrationally hate and discriminate against homosexuals because they believe they are evil (i.e. Sinners). They are free to see themselves as Soldiers of God if they choose to. Obviously, all of us use words to describe people. There are many ways of describing prejudice, hatred, irrationality, loathing of "evil", etc. You have every bit as much freedom to determine the best word in describing individual cases as anyone else does. Keep in mind that it is in the nature of unconscious anxieties (especially where it involves ones sense of identity) to deny the sense of dread; so it is not surprising to find people wishing to "purify" their hatred and their discrimination as it were, so that it does not (so far as they are capable of knowing) reflect on their own sexual disquietude. Let me ask you: If a person hates homosexuals because of the irrational belief that they are evil simply by virtue of their innate biological gender bias...BUT they have no awareness of any unconscious sexual anxiety...what is the alternative word you would like to use? What would such a person prefer to be called...if they are so absolutely convinced that their hatred does not have a component of fear? Can we simply call such people "honey"--or does that distort the language and cause anxiety and confusion? Words generally have many nuances of meaning. Take the word "refractory" which was earlier used as an adjective. Compare that, or almost any other word, with the utter simplicity and clarity of "homophobic". Hardly something to whine about when you consider the convoluted meanings of other words. Words may trace back to a literal interpretation of prefix, suffix, root, etc. These are important to philologists; but they are not overly important to the attempt of ordinary people to convey meaning or meaning(s), which are suitable and appropriate to context and description; or in using them in a manner not incompatible with standard usage. It is applied as it is meant to apply--see above. It describes those who have an irrational fear of homosexuality which may also express itself as aversion or discrimination. Those who do not have these problems are not homophobic, and nobody is claiming that they are. YOU--"If that was the only way it is applied I would not have any problem with it". That is the way it is properly applied. I have never heard it applied otherwise. There is always the assumption that there is anxiety underlying the aggression. This is commonplace and common sense, and need not be stated unless one is in a teaching seminar. The overt manifestation of the homophobic attitude: the discrimination--in whichever form it takes, from mild to brutal--this is what naturally confronts people, and it is to this that people will normally address their concerns. It is not necessary that the underlying motive be referred to; nor is it condign...for it can only be evidenced by implication, and not by observation. I have never encountered a phobia of homophobia before. I wonder what that is about...