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Politics : Should God be replaced? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/16/2002 12:44:30 PM
From: Mitch Blevins  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 28931
 
>>Try as you might, you can not take away from the scope of the Bible. From Genesis to Revelation is a story that is untouched by any other religion.<<

This appears to be a vague assertion dressed up as an objective statement. In what way do you define "scope" and "untouched", and how does this measure up to the (say) Buddhist Pali canon of scripture? We know that the Pali canon has more scope in terms of volume of material (five linear feet of shelf space) and amount of time covered (the Bible only goes back 6 to 12 thousand years). The topics covered in the Pali canon range from morality, salvation, and the gods, to diet and brushing your teeth. Just the Jataka tales alone (a small part of the canon) offer more stories/fables than are found in the entire Bible.

Is there some non-subjective criteria you are using when making this statement?



To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/16/2002 6:22:37 PM
From: 2MAR$  Respond to of 28931
 
This is why I believe focusing on hell is ridiculous. In no way to I deny its existence, but it is not what I let my mind dwell on.

And that is why I think we all like you as a brother ,
brother JK !

Those are all nice quotes , and certainly man's circumstances have changed and evolved say, since the time of Babylon , or even of Ancient Sumaria .

Man is an inquisitive creature; a thinker, an inventor of tools , an observer of nature , and record keeper , the artist , the discoverer , the moralist ,the meditator, the lover and the hater, the noble savage , maker of religion & states , and the scientist .

Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable–if anything is excellent or praiseworthy–think about such things.

Honestly JK , those words above could be taken exactly from the liturgy and minds of a dozen major religious traditions from cultures preceding Christianity , to even some native Americans . That's the true revelation.

Try as you might, you can not take away from the scope of the Bible. From Genesis to Revelation is a story that is untouched by any other religion.


I don't have to try I can sing my own songs of love , and find my own stories. In truth , the whole entire scope of Christianity that you inherited today , is all owed to humble "Monastics" from the earliest period that kept faithful observance of the purest form
of the teaching .

I am usually always overfond of any Monks , whether they are Buddhist or Christian or Hindu. They all resonate with a similar quality , regardless of what dogma and history they have followed . I am also very overfond of other people and professions and arts , that also come upon shores of deep reflection , crystal clear thinking and
good spirit , that recieve their "revelations" thru other means besides religion per se.

And that is my proof to you that Christianity is not the Alpha and Omega ....but one expression of the growth of the human spirit , and something perrenially good inside . What you quote to me that was written in words , was recited for
over 4000 yrs over in India. The only difference is in India they did not get to writing it
all down till 1500bc.



To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/16/2002 6:55:40 PM
From: 2MAR$  Respond to of 28931
 
Try as you might, you can not take away from the scope of the Bible. From Genesis to Revelation is a story that is untouched by any other religion.



more than touched it is equalled and surpassed in scope in Hinduism . The creation , is seen as but one creation of many infinite number of creations , and they were concieving expanses of time of the current age of this creation that could not even be imagined by Christians living say , even 150yrs ago. The Hindu sages saw an "age"
of one creation cycle at around 350,000yrs .

And this was far far back many centuries...and completely dwarfs the Judao/Christian creation myth in scope and imagination. It is absolutely stunning what they actually did come up with .



To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/16/2002 7:00:09 PM
From: 2MAR$  Respond to of 28931
 
It's very interesting to note , that with the terrible persecutions and complete destruction of Tibet since that ruthless Chinese invasion ....with almost 6,000 temples destroyed and 100's of thousands of monks and people murdered , tortured and imprisoned ....

you have never heard one word of revenge or hate or act of retaliation or conspiracy of returning the violence uttered by any Tibetan leader ever since .

It says a great deal about their teaching ....



To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/16/2002 7:31:14 PM
From: 2MAR$  Respond to of 28931
 
Creation Stories,

myths that explain the origin of the universe, or cosmos. The origin of the cosmos forms one of the principal themes of mythology throughout the world. Most mythologies view the process of creation as belonging to the distant past. Some mythological traditions, however, present creation as a continuing cycle of birth and destruction, as in Hindu tradition or in the belief of the native peoples of Central America in the so-called Five Suns that governed successive worlds (see Hinduism; Pre-Columbian Religions).

Students of mythology often draw a distinction between creation myths proper, or cosmogonies, and myths of origins. Cosmogonies tell how the cosmos arose or was created from a primal state. Myths of origin explain how later features of the known world—such as human beings, animals, and the social order—came into being. In practice, however, stories of origin usually represent continuations of a cosmogony, recounting the further development of an original creative act.

Most creation stories assume the eternity of matter or even of the world itself. However, these myths hold that the world in its precreation state was uninhabitable and must be organized either by the action of cosmic forces or by creator deities. Certain images of the primal, or precreation, state of the universe are common to a number of mythological traditions. Some myths represent the primal state as a void. Others depict it as a chaos of indistinct elements. Still others present it as a primeval sea, or as a cosmic egg containing all things in embryonic form.

Some creation myths reflect the environmental circumstances of a particular culture. For example, in Mesopotamia, located between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, a dependence on irrigation systems and the perpetual threat of flooding were a pervasive feature of life. Accordingly, the action and control of the waters played a major role in the mythology of Sumer, an early Mesopotamian civilization. In Sumerian mythology, the primeval sea, personified by the goddess Nammu, is the source of the gods and of the cosmos. When the gods decide to destroy their human creations, they do so by sending a flood (see Ancient Middle Eastern Religions; Deluge).

(Sound familiar ?)

Creation mythologies explain the actual formation of the world by a variety of processes. These processes include the sacrifice of a primal being (for example, a giant or serpent); a struggle between supernatural powers; the blending or coalescing of elements, particularly water and earth; the incubation of a cosmic egg; and the uttering of a divine word. In myths that credit primary creation to gods, such as the Greek deities Uranus (sky god) and Gaea (earth goddess), these deities often become hazy, remote figures in later mythology, and stories often recount their overthrow by their own offspring. For example, in the Greek tradition, Zeus succeeded his father Cronus and grandfather Uranus to become ruler of the gods (see Greek Mythology).

Many mythological accounts ascribe creation to impersonal agents rather than to individual deities. In some African traditions, a cosmic egg hatched to release spirits called Nommo, who then set about the creation of mankind. In Egyptian mythology, both personal and impersonal creative forces came into play: Elemental energies were personified by four divine couples who fused to form the cosmic egg, from which the sun god was born. In later Egyptian mythology, the sun god became identified with the figure of Ra, a deity who gave rise to a pantheon of high gods (known as the Nine Gods of Heliopolis) through self-fertilization (see Egyptian Mythology). Many mythologies include similar stories of self-fertilization by a creator deity, whose offspring then give birth to other gods, creating a pantheon based on incestuous family relationships. The most famous such line of descent occurs in Greek mythology, in which Zeus begets offspring by many goddesses and mortals.

Many creation myths focus on the idea that primal elements were separated or made distinct from one another during the act of creation. In ancient Egyptian mythology, creation began when a mound of land first distinguished itself in the midst of the primal waters. In the biblical Genesis story, Yahweh's creation of the world is described mainly in terms of separating—for example, the separation of light from darkness, and of sea from land. In other creation mythologies, the raw material for making the world derives from a specific source. A widespread Native American myth tells of the descent into the depths of the ocean of a so-called earth-diver, an animal—often a turtle—who brings back mud from which the world is fashioned (see Native American Religions). In Indian Vedic tradition, the body of the primordial man, Purusha, is dismembered to provide material for the world and everything in it (see Veda). A similar theme occurs in the Norse myth in which the primal giant Ymir is killed by Odin and his brothers, who then make the sky from his skull, the earth from his body, and the sea from his blood.

Cosmogonic myths generally culminate in the creation of humankind, after which the mythic cosmos comes to resemble the world of human experience. In mythic history, the earliest era of the world is usually the closest to perfection—a Golden Age or Garden of Eden—with later phases showing the progressive degeneration of the world as it grows more distant from the original creative impulse. The earliest humans are often thought to have been of extraordinary stature and longevity and to have been much closer to the gods than are the humans of the present day. In many traditions the story cycles associated with demigods and heroes are an even richer source of myth than those involving the gods themselves. Such myths enable the listener to recall the time of creation when the world was in its infancy.

*From Mr Softie's Encarta

;-)



To: Grandk who wrote (12355)5/25/2002 10:17:29 PM
From: vds4  Respond to of 28931
 
"I agree that there have been some ugly episodes, but on the flip side is all the beauty that has entered the world through Christianity"

I wonder, could not anyone who truly believes in something say the same about their beliefs? Religion, science, etc...

I think anyone convinced and content with their faith/logic must believe the above statement. It need not be restricted to christianity. Similar statements are made by lawyers about their respective legal systems and scientists about the path of research and discovery.

martin