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To: E who wrote (16143)	6/30/2002 12:57:25 PM
From: Lazarus_Long	Respond to of 21057

military trials of American citizens are unconstitutional Unquestionably, unless martial law has been declared. This would allow detention w/o trial: Article I Section 9. ........................................................................................ The privilege of the writ of habeas corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in cases of rebellion or invasion the public safety may require it. and that "the most recent antiterrorism legislation will allow the police to compel records from any business regarding any person, including medical records from hospitals, educational records from universities, and even records of books that have been checked out from the local library or purchased from the bookstore." I fail to see any change to previous subpoena powers. "If present trends continue, it is likely that America will drift toward national identification cards These really already exist don't they? SS cards? A "benefit" of the welfare state? One of the points conservatives have tried to make for decades is that such things are so easily abused by gov'ts. , a national police force, And what are the FBI, ATF, DEA, ......? and more extensive military involvement in domestic affairs," That we've avoided - so far.

To: E who wrote (16143)	6/30/2002 2:13:46 PM
From: Ish	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

I said I haven't lost any rights under Bush. Of course I'm not breaking any laws either. Matter of fact I feel my 2nd Amendment right is even better protected now.

To: E who wrote (16143)	6/30/2002 5:24:52 PM
From: Michael M	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21057

Wake up, yourself, E. In your haste to label something "right wing" you seemed to have overlooked Cato's own words on the site you linked. That finger of yours must get awful tired from all that pointing. From the Cato site - How to Label Cato Today, those who subscribe to the principles of the American Revolution--individual liberty, limited government, the free market, and the rule of law--call themselves by a variety of terms, including conservative, libertarian, classical liberal, and liberal. We see problems with all of those terms. "Conservative" smacks of an unwillingness to change, of a desire to preserve the status quo. Only in America do people seem to refer to free-market capitalism--the most progressive, dynamic, and ever-changing system the world has ever known--as conservative. Additionally, many contemporary American conservatives favor state intervention in some areas, most notably in trade and into our private lives. "Classical liberal" is a bit closer to the mark, but the word "classical" connotes a backward-looking philosophy. Finally, "liberal" may well be the perfect word in most of the world--the liberals in societies from China to Iran to South Africa to Argentina are supporters of human rights and free markets--but its meaning has clearly been corrupted by contemporary American liberals. The Jeffersonian philosophy that animates Cato's work has increasingly come to be called "libertarianism" or "market liberalism." It combines an appreciation for entrepreneurship, the market process, and lower taxes with strict respect for civil liberties and skepticism about the benefits of both the welfare state and foreign military adventurism. The market-liberal vision brings the wisdom of the American Founders to bear on the problems of today. As did the Founders, it looks to the future with optimism and excitement, eager to discover what great things women and men will do in the coming century. Market liberals appreciate the complexity of a great society, they recognize that socialism and government planning are just too clumsy for the modern world. It is--or used to be--the conventional wisdom that a more complex society needs more government, but the truth is just the opposite. The simpler the society, the less damage government planning does. Planning is cumbersome in an agricultural society, costly in an industrial economy, and impossible in the information age. Today collectivism and planning are outmoded and backward, a drag on social progress. Market liberals have a cosmopolitan, inclusive vision for society. We reject the bashing of gays, Japan, rich people, and immigrants that contemporary liberals and conservatives seem to think addresses society's problems. We applaud the liberation of blacks and women from the statist restrictions that for so long kept them out of the economic mainstream. Our greatest challenge today is to extend the promise of political freedom and economic opportunity to those who are still denied it, in our own country and around the world.