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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (50679)	10/9/2002 11:24:02 PM
From: Sir Francis Drake	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Hamas and PIJ are still responsible for the lion's share of suicide bombings, actually, Wrong. In for the past year or so, the AA can claim the vast majority of attackers. Al Aqsa is something of a Johnny-come-lately on the scene. And Al Aqsa is very much copying the program of Hamas, not the other way around. It is the jihadist ideology that thought up the idea of the suicide bomb as the great equalizer. All quite true. The AA copied it, for they thought it effective, and as an implicit rejection of Arafat and the "old guards" ways. The tragedy here is that Israel radicalized and split the PA - as the younger generation saw Arafat and his way as bringing nothing but more settlements (Netanyahu disgracefully broke signed agreements), they turned to methods that Hamas and PIJ were using. The bottom line however, is still MOTIVATION. Methodology, you adopt from whomever, including even your enemies. Salient point - Palestinians see themselves as fighting for liberation, defending themselves against the armies of foreign invaders, occupying forces. And sadly, they are right about the facts re: Israel's actions. Nope, don't buy it. The PA said something about accepting Israel, true. They also said something about renouncing terror and settling differences by negotiation. The second was false, why should anyone believe the first? That is a lie by Israeli propaganda. The PA did NOT support terrorism - in fact they cooperated with Israel to contain it. Of course, when Israel decided to destroy the PA in an insane plan to deligitmize Palestinian national aspirations (note also Sharon's blatant provocations that touched off the current uprising), that cooperation had to stop. But still, the PA did not actively participate in terror - which is not to say that some of their members did not, uncontrollably. For can anyone totally control their extremists? Can Israel? Certainly they failed to stop Rabin being killed by an ISRAELI JEW, and they failed to stop settlers numerous terrorist attacks against Palestinians. So why do the Israelis hypocritically demand 100% effectiveness from the PA, when that is not physically possible in this world? And when you basically declare war against the PA - look at the disgraceful attacks on Arafat's compound (imagine what you'd think if the PA laid seige to the Knesset), why do you expect them to abstain from defending themselves... with the only weapons they have? It is an Israeli propaganda lie however that the PA was not clamping down on terror, even now. You don't buy the Arab nation's acceptance of Israel. Seems Egypt did, and Jordan did, and given a chance many more Arab countries would. But they cannot do so, while their populations are livid with anger at the Israeli violent war against Palestinians. According to you if the Arabs object to Israeli treatment of Palestinians, well, that shows that they don't accept Israel pre-67. If they explicitly do, well then you suspect their motives, and basically say: "I don't believe it". Well, nothing will convince YOU, but that has not much to do with the reality on the ground. As to the Arab press. Please, I can also find outrageous statements by Israeli extremists... have you ever read some of the stuff printed by the Kach and their ilk? Would make you wonder if they didn't crib notes from the Nazis. Sorry, but you can't bring up that as proof that Arabs would not recognize Israel's right to exist. Extremists voices on both sides should not be the determining ones, and it is silly to treat them as such. Is there anti-Semitism, vile, brutal, thoroughly abominable kind among Arabs? Yes. But there are equally ugly voices in Israel. Citing these as the norm is not illuminating the issues. Besides, as I'm sure you are aware, this is a complex issue - a lot of stuff written in Arab newspapers is for domestic consumption by regimes that have little legitimacy in an effort to placate (and sometimes distract) the population... you can't take it at face value as representing what they'd actually do when the rubber hit the road. I think that with the exception of Iraq and Libya you'd have all the rest of the Arab countries recognize Israel pre-67.