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Politics : Should God be replaced? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: briskit who wrote (13717)	10/12/2002 9:34:46 PM
From: James Calladine	Respond to of 28931

RIGHT LIFE Here's a bit about "right life" from my Teacher, Adi Da: "Right life-or life based on the discovery of the hurt and the fruitlessness of egoity, and of attachment to any and every kind of ego-based (and ego-serving, or, otherwise, ego-reinforcing) "bonding"-is (necessarily) about ego-transcendence. And right life is also, when founded on most profound self-understanding, a philosophical or religious process that is primarily moved by the Impulse to Realize Real God, or Truth, or Reality, or Divine Liberation. All else is a naive, self-indulgent, and absurd enterprise, based on egoity and immaturity. That dimension of actually (or, otherwise, potentially) right life that can be described as "social Wisdom" (or true Wisdom, socially applied) is, in its right and authentic forms, founded in the discovery that ego-based "bonding" (and, therefore, egoity itself) hurts and is fruitless-and, therefore, all right and authentic "social Wisdom" is associated with philosophical and religious motivations toward the transcending of the ego-"I" through enlarging the sphere of "bonding", beyond the self-referring body-mind, to social relations, the good of the whole (or the true good of even any other), and the good of the world as a whole (including the good of the planetary sphere itself). And that process of ego-transcending "bonding" to all that is conditionally greater than the ego-"I" is (in the context of greatest "social Wisdom", founded in true philosophical or religious motivations toward Real God, or Truth, or Reality, or Divine Liberation) regarded only as a necessary preliminary (or a functional, practical, relational, and cultural) means toward ego-transcending Communion with (and, Most Ultimately, egoless Realization of) Real God, or Truth, or Reality, or Divine Liberation, Itself. Therefore, from the point of view of all truly right and authentic "social Wisdom"-not the ego-"I", and not any intimate or (otherwise) familial relation, and not any social unit (great or small), and not the planet, and not even the total cosmic domain is the "That" to which life must be (in the ego-surrendering manner) "Bonded" (as the final and Ultimate purpose of life). Rather, from the point of view of all truly right and authentic "social Wisdom", the ego-"I", and all possible relations, and even the entire cosmic domain must be progressively transcended in That Which Is Always Already The Case (Beyond all hurt, all suffering, all separateness, all relatedness, all self-contraction, all of egoity, even all that is conditionally manifested), and Which Is That of Which even all "I's" and all conditions are a merely apparent modification-such that, by Realizing That (Real God, or Truth, or Reality), the ego-"I", all others, and all of conditional manifestation are transcended in a beginningless and endless Divine Liberation." FROM: Eleutherios Namaste! Jim

To: briskit who wrote (13717)	10/13/2002 10:25:13 AM
From: briskit	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 28931

If I understand him, and I'm not saying I do, Adi Da makes the distinction I hoped to make. 2Mar$ description of Christianity being about giving up the world, and detachment from desire and ego actually fit Adi Da much better than it does Judeo-Christianity. While Christianity's goal is that we become "one with God", it does not do so at the cost of individuality or distinctions between God and God's creation. That is a difference worth noting, perhaps the difference worth noting. Christian's might "lose themselves in God" as opposed to being self-absorbed or self-centered, but they remain nonetheless themselves. So does everyone else. That is why "love your neighbor as yourself" sums up one's obligation in living with others, and speaks to the heart of God's interests. This present reality and existence are taken seriously as important to God, so to speak. While perhaps transitory, they are not illusory. And the relationships between people represent the highest practical application of their understanding of God as relational. Whatever problems one has with Judaism, one must agree that their contribution was the idea of a God who included people in an agreement on how to relate to God and others. If the idea of a covenant relationship with God is not unique to them, they, along with Christianity, certainly contribute the longest running example of a people related to God attempting to put into practice the application and relevance of that belief. That is the kind of relationship, and relational beginning of their understanding of God, that determines their concept of the nature of God. They cannot affirm that God established a relationship with concrete people in concrete history, then deny the importance of material reality, real people, and real events. Perhaps Adi Da and Muhammed agree that Judeo-Christianity is superceded by their more mature ideas, though they differ from each other in how it is so. But I think it is right that those are clearly distinguishing characteristics. (Well, I am leaving so do I post this and clean up the mess later, or wait and edit and re-consider? I'll post it, with reservations and apologies for incoherence.)

To: briskit who wrote (13717)	10/14/2002 9:05:46 PM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 28931

Your comment seems to be coming somewhat from that general direction, using "monastic", giving up desires, etc Well simply and naturally seen and put , we all just do most of our best work alone . Some of the most true "religious" work might also be seen being done by many other paths of adventure life's road takes one down. Not all religion must where vestures and robes or be celebate . As for women and marriage , keeping a household, family life and being part of a community is seen in Hinduism as sacred a duty as being alone on the mountaintop . Very old stuff this idea of the fulfillment "Dharma " thru gracefully living thru the natural stages of life . A very naturalistic philosophy which is "goodness centered" because goodness usuall just works best . Doing unto others what you would have done to you seems to be a very ancient piece of wisdom and if given by God , that God is far older than Jehova I am positive of . Life is seen coming in stages , just as you see with an acorn into an oak ...infancy , forming child/youth , young student, learning stage , marrying/uniting becoming a householder and active community member ...then perhaps elderstatesman and eventually the natural simplifying and possible renuciation stage that may tend come for some later . All the stages are part of a continuum which is part of your Dharma . The fulness of the experience is there and always teaching us something . I can remember many experiences that were tremendously full in my life , and was aware of the stages. Experience also transpires on many levels in each of us as we go thru the stages , there is always a need for meditation and reflection , and often mantras are used to keep mind centered and refocussed , and the East uses many murtis and representing many aspects of what is divine and of wonder and awe about the experience of being alive beyond the pure mechanistic repetitive in life .(The industrial revolution was such a liberating experience for so many wasn't it ? <G>) Christians use the Murti of Jesus sacrifice, the crucifix , the Bible ...the Mohamedans use the Koran and other decor etc Essentially all similar tools to evoke and focus the energies at play within the unfolding Dharma of all our lives . It is the play of the energies with the organs and systems of our own beings at play in the field of time , that comprises a projected complexity that some choose to call "God ". God is that projection and depiction of the own universe of energy and interplay with us . Life is simply a very impressive and completely vast stage for you to find yourself on. And it is pretty vast , but can become very confining too . No religion is even remotely capable of describing all that life is . I can tell you one thing , that God is an amazin dancer , and if you have no passion in life , if but even to be tranquil , then something's missing . Life is the greatest experience there is , and worthy of some "awe". We all have it as children , the trick is to grow without losing it (no original sin , stupid dogmatic nonsense is that, BTW Jesus was wise in some ways , very superstitious in others some of his later followers were absolutely completely inhibited and unimaginative really) If there is a God though , he/she is a very good dancer ! ;-)