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Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Srexley who wrote (309687)	10/18/2002 1:56:43 PM
From: MSI	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 769670

"Sounds like you think the gov't wants to oppress us" Yep. It's the nature of the beast. "But I also think that our government (particularly repubs) like our freedom and have no intentions of taking it away" You haven't been paying attention to current events. Look at legislation and rhetoric since Bush was installed. Big Brother has arrived. Even if you are a citizen who supports Bush Inc. the new laws allow you to be declared an enemy combatant, locked up, tried, convicted, and executed with secret evidence that your lawyer can't see, because you can't have a lawyer. Your house can be searched without your knowledge, your bookseller and librarian is forced to turn over records of books you've read and will go to jail if they tell you they've been asked about you. Your phones and computers can be tapped without any further authorization. George Orwell couldn't have been closer to the mark. "...and the demos again are the main culprits. They fight every tax cut and get in line for every increase. " The reality is far different than the GOP rhetoric. Republicans have spent trillions more under Reagan, Bush and Bush than Democrat administrations. They use war-mongering, hate-mongering and fear to generate spending. What you don't realize is that ANY spending by government is a tax, whether it comes on April 15th or later, it WILL come out of your pocket. That's a nasty bit of government subterfuge, particularly by the GOP, but Congress in general revels in fooling people to extract dollars. Reagan tripled the national debt, and tax REVENUES also increased and Bushes are on the road to another record. Clinton reduced the national debt, under the same accounting. That said, remember another thing: government accounting is dishonestly used to hide real indebtedness, so it is MUCH worse than stated above. The only hope is to fire them all and get true public servants in. This will be promptly accomplished by full disclosure of every public dollar, program and project on the web.

To: Srexley who wrote (309687)	10/18/2002 2:23:24 PM
From: MSI	Respond to of 769670

John Q. Adams on 4th of July, 1821 said it well, comparing the US to the compliant British subjects: "The people of Britain, through long ages of civil war, had extorted from their tyrants not acknowledgements, but grants, of right. With this concession they had been content to stop in the progress of human improvement." I.e., the ruling powers have no intention of "liking our freedoms". What they like, is tyranny, unless you can force them otherwise through constant vigilance and occasional revolt. It's the nature of the beast, regardless of who is in power. There is no such thing as a benevolent philosopher-king who operates in secret and remains honest. We now have a secretive, dishonest dictatorship brewing in this country. "They received their freedom as a donation from their sovereigns; they appealed for their privileges to a sign manual and a seal; they held their title to liberty, like their title to lands, from the bounty of a man; and in their moral and political chronology, the great charter of Runny Mead was the beginning of the world . . . the fabric of their institutions . . . had been founded in conquest; it had been cemented in servitude . . . instead of solving civil society into its first elements in search of their rights, they looked back only to conquest as the origin of their liberties, and claimed their rights but as donations from their kings. This faltering assertion of freedom is not chargeable indeed upon the whole nation. There were spirits capable of tracing civil government to its foundation in the moral and physical nature of man; but conquest and servitude were so mingled up in every particle of the social existence of the nation, that they had become vitally necessary to them . . ." True even today. Yet you say, "I believe them unless they give me reason to do otherwise." That's the path to a loss of liberty that can't be regained except by revolt.