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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: zonder who wrote (55107)10/28/2002 4:18:48 AM
From: LindyBill  Respond to of 281500
 
Militant Islam's New Strongholds

by Daniel Pipes and Jonathan Schanzer
New York Post
October 22, 2002

The recent bombing of a nightclub in Bali, Indonesia, killing at least 183 and injuring hundreds, fits into a larger pattern. Militant Islam used to be mostly confined to Middle Easterners, but in recent years it has spread to Muslims in other parts of the world.

This can be seen especially in the cases of Indonesia, Bangladesh and Nigeria, three countries with a combined population of about 494 million inhabitants. Their Muslim population of some 378 million constitutes about a third of the global Muslim community.

Indonesia: This Southeast Asian country, 88 percent Muslim, hosts Islamist efforts to impose Islamic law (Shari'a) through both legal and violent means.

In the province of Aceh alone, more than 6,000 lives have been lost in fighting between the Islamist "Free Aceh Movement" and government forces. Asian intelligence sources believe this group may be an al Qaeda affiliate. The goal of these and other radicals, CNS News reports, is "to turn the world's most populous Muslim country into an extremist Islamic state by 2003." Muslim-Christian tensions have led to a full-blown religious war on other islands.

In Sulawesi, Islamists have deployed roadblocks, armored bulldozers and rocket launchers, thereby isolating the indigenous Christian community. They have also systematically targeted Christians, forcing them to convert, circumcising their children, burning churches and other buildings.

In all, Muslim-Christian clashes in Indonesia have killed more than 19,000 since 1999 and left over 600,000 displaced from their homes.

Bangladesh: Islamists in this 83 percent Muslim country of South Asia aspire to establish a true "Islamic Republic of Bangladesh" with a constitution based on the Shari'a. The goal, says the head of one group, is to "pursue a slow but steady policy towards Islamization of the country" - much like Afghanistan under the Taliban.

Not surprisingly, al Qaeda has tentacles in Bangladesh. "Harakat ul-Jihad Islami, Bangladesh" was reportedly established with direct aid from Osama bin Laden in 1992 and calls itself the "Bangladeshi Taliban." The group claimed responsibility for attacking U.S. government offices in Calcutta, killing five policemen in January 2002.

Since Sept. 11, thousands of al Qaeda supporters have taken to the streets of Dhaka after Friday prayers, touting posters that read: "Osama is our Hero," while burning effigies of President George W. Bush.

Meanwhile, members of minority religions have suffered from ghastly violence, including collective terror. The Nation reports that some Buddhists and Christians were blinded, had fingers cut off or had hands amputated, while "others had iron rods nailed through their legs or abdomen." Women and children have "been gang-raped, often in front of their fathers or husbands." In addition, hundreds of temples were desecrated and statues destroyed; thousands of homes and businesses looted or burned.

As for Hindus, the human rights organization Freedom House reports they have been subject to "rape, torture and killing and the destruction of their cultural and religious identity at the hands of Muslims." In one indicative step, Islamists sometimes force Hindu women to dress in the Islamist fashion.

Nigeria: Disregarding both the Nigerian constitution (which stipulates a separation of church and state) and demographic realities (only 50 percent of the population is Muslim), Islamists of this West African country have adopted or announced plans to adopt some version of Islamic law in 12 of its 36 states since 1999.

Implementing Islamic law means forbidding such practices as the construction of churches, music performances, the wearing of pants, drinking alcohol and riding in mixed-gender taxis. Forced conversions to Islam are reported, as well as coerced divorces of Muslim women from Christian men.

Vigilantes enforce Islamic law via punishments that include stoning, flogging and the chopping off of hands. Solidarity visits from Sudanese, Pakistani, Saudi, Palestinian and Syrian Islamists tie Nigeria to the wider forces of militant Islam. Freedom House concludes that Nigeria is undergoing a process of "Talibanization."

*

That militant Islam and its companion violence have spread from the Middle Eastern core to the periphery of the Muslim world is of great concern. It means that the enemies of the United States, moderate Islam, and of civilization itself are far more numerous and entrenched than previously thought. This implies that the current war will likely be longer, bloodier and more demanding than most people imagine.



To: zonder who wrote (55107)10/28/2002 10:44:27 AM
From: Hawkmoon  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
What the US did on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was, in my humble opinion, a war crime.

Good thing we won, eh??

Or else Harry S. Truman would have gone down in history as a war criminal, not one of the more notable US presidents.

But it's easy for you to sit on your Monaco beach, (weren't you guys under the protection of the Vichy government) and tell us that it's a war crime for the US to make every effort to terminate the war as rapidly as possible, even if we use nuclear weapons (and we knew what kind of damage they would do since we tested one at Alamagordo)..

You'd do the same thing if you had to answer to the parents of all of those Americans who would have died in an invasion of Japan, as to why you chose Japanese lives over those of your own people...

Hawk@winnerswritethehistorybooks.com



To: zonder who wrote (55107)10/28/2002 12:48:20 PM
From: Nadine Carroll  Respond to of 281500
 
The truth is that:
1) Nobody knew that this sort of devastation would ensue when nuclear weapons are employed.
2) The bombs were dropped to save American lives.


A few points:

1. Creating such a blast and firestorm in a city was not a new idea by August 1945. By that point in WWII it had already been achieved in several cities, eg. Dresden and Tokyo among others. What was new about nukes was the "bang for the buck" -- with nukes, you could achieve a firestorm with one bomb anytime you liked, instead of needing a fleet of bombers dropping thousands of bombs every night for a week under just the right atmospheric conditions.

2. The atomic blast was known from the test; but the fallout took everyone by surprise.

3. Of course the bombs were dropped to save American lives. Does it need to be said that in war to try to kill the enemy and save the lives of your own troops? The army was anticipating a million American casualties, dead and wounded, in the invasion of the home islands. It wasn't until after the war that some Japanese admitted that the bomb had also saved Japanese lives. The Japanese were training girls to die fighting with bamboo staves by that point.

For an interesting discussion of the decision to drop the bomb in the context of its time, see Paul Fussell's book, Thank God for the Atom Bomb. He's not being ironical, btw, he was in combat in the South Pacific and would have been in one of the first units to invade Kyushu.

I don't understand how you charge anybody with a war crime in the middle of a total war. How do you escape the conclusion that the whole war is a war crime? Even the victorious allies didn't charge the Germans for The Blitz or Coventry; just the slaughter of unarmed civilians for no military purpose in the Holocaust. Many people thought that too was "victor's justice".