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Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Thomas A Watson who wrote (319680)	11/15/2002 5:43:30 PM
From: Johannes Pilch	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 769667

I did not say you had a problem with President Bush. I said you stated President Bush is liar. There is a philosophical difference between saying someone is a liar and that someone has lied. Clinton was a liar, Bush has used a strategic lie to help neutralize the enemy. I think what he did was spread propaganda regarding Islam so as to mollify Islamics both here and abroad. And it is working. Muslims seem generally pleased and many yet support the potential strike against Iraq. Now you are plainly trying to avoid the difference between what I said and what you've made it to be. You insist on claiming I called Bush a liar, as if I am trying to impugn the man's essential morality. I did no such thing. I have said I believe and yet beleive that Bush is telling a lie about Islam to leave open the political channels between muslims so that he might hit Iraq when the time comes. If that offends you, then too bad. I reject that because the biggest liar of all time just left the White House... Just because Clinton was, as you say, "the biggest liar of all time" is no reason to reject that Bush has strategically lied. The conclusion simply does not follow and shows you to be highly inept at putting together premises and conclusions. a Wise President would never directly lie. Any direct statement would be the truth with no dishonest intent. Well then what you claim here is that a wise president would never employ deception amidst war. And that is clearly false. It a simple issue of character that you have no clue about. Oh I have quite a clue about at least one character here, and it leads me to believe this character is quite fubar when he claims presidents in wartime cannot employ strategic deception. Consider the many times PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH was asked if he had ever used drugs. The words given were the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I weary of you. Here I have repeatedly referred to deception as a valid wartime political tool and you keep talking crap. Consider that answer of the biggest liar that ever was I smoked but did not inhale. Pure nitwittian crap. The two circumstances here have absolutely nothing to do with one another and yet you just keep on acting like a blame fool. If you cannot figure out why your proffer of a lie is idiotic, you cannot figure out anything relating to the judgement of others character or intentions. And if you can't figure out that deception and propaganda (i.e. political lies) are valid tools for a president in war, then you apparently ain't got what it takes to ever lead anything of substance - thank goodness. The examples you cite show what. Was money sent or given by many, but obtained by false pretences. Several mosques out of how many? How many really knew where the money was going?... It only took 19 muslims to destroy the entire WTC complex. Put the dang thing together tommy and stop acting like such a blame fool. So you say that money was being collected so Muslims could come to America and kill Americans??? I guess Irish Americans gave money to the IRA to kill Americans and not my relatives. The IRA ain't coming here and bombing the dang WTC, tommy. The IRA ain't bombing innocent australians and women and children all over the dang world, tommy. And though comprised of catholics, they didn't even kill the folks they've killed in the name of some holy catholic war. They aren't even claiming Catholicism encourages their terrorism at all. And no catholic led country is teaching their children to long for the destruction of my country. Now you ought to be smart enough to see the difference here, tommy. If you ain't then there really isn't much help left you. The most telling statement you make is this to my question. How many American Muslims have committed suicide killing Americans?...I see you said Muslims and not American Muslims. Because whether the muslims who took out the towers were actual American citizens or not is completely irrelevant. The fact is, those folks were living in American society and benefitting from the American social trust granted to the entire muslim community. That muslim community supported those folks both directly and indirectly. As a result, that community is clearly a matter of concern. That is exactly why the FBI is even now moving into mosques and muslim organizations to see their ties to terrorists, this, above the protests of muslims. You are really refering to islamists or terrorists who call themselves Muslims. False. I am referring to muslims who are terrorists. I am in no position to redefine these folks, claiming they are not muslims when they are not clearly rejected by the muslim community worldwide. The fact is whole populations of Islamic countries are fed steady the same hatred that the muslim terrorists have implemented against me. Their highest leaders, in mosques, using the dang Koran, constantly encourage muslims to hate me, adn they even encourage war against me. This is going on all across the muslim world and where is there a clear counterbalancing muslim struggle against it? Name one Islamic cleric in any Islamic country anywhere in the world who has ever issued a fatwa against suicide bombing or any suicide bomber, against terrorism or any terrorist. Name even one. Yet these same muslims issue fatwas against a guy just for writing a dang book. You can murder thousands of people and not even one muslim authority, even in America will issue a fatwa against the perps, but write a book that they don't like and they start calling for your dang head. That is friggin' whacked. So if the muslims will not reject the terrorists as muslims, then I sure can't. The terrorists are definitely muslims because they have won the fight to define Islam. No one who matters (an you don't) is rejecting them as muslims. They are likely here hidding among and from innocent Muslim Americans. And they are not Americans or have not been in the past. Their technical citizenship status is irrelevant when they can comfortably exist here deriving support from the muslim community, enjoying American social trust and slaughtering thousands of Americans. Since 911, nothing has really happened. If I see several event and repeating events here, then you could make a poor case and currently have no case whatsoever. Well fine. 911 was enough for me, and the attempts against us subsequent to 911 were too. So are the threats of nuclear weapons use coming from the muslims even now. They warned us before 911 and now they are warning us again. If you need more than 911 and all the bombings and threats to westerners that are clearly happening before your eyes, then I think you have a serious problem with reality and that there is nothing that will ever move you toward reason.