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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Karen Lawrence who wrote (58386)	11/22/2002 7:39:48 PM
From: Machaon	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

===> "Israel must expel the 3 million Palestinians living in the occupied territories--and perhaps even its own Palestinian citizens--in order to achieve peace and security." <=== Sad choice, isn't it? If the Arabs would only recognize Jews (and Christians) rights to live in the region, there could be peace. Currently, most Arab nations refuse to recognize Israel's right to exist, and teach hatred towards Christians and Jews in their schools. When faced with enemies, such as these, who have waged five wars against you, in the hopes of killing every Jew, what does the Jewish state do? What would you do?

To: Karen Lawrence who wrote (58386)	11/22/2002 7:50:44 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

From the extreme right (those behind the posters) to the radical left, Israelis agree on at least two points: The current crisis must be dealt with, and land is the major issue around which the Israeli-Palestinian conflict revolves Absolutely false. Only the far-left in Israel still thinks that this a border dispute. The rest of Israel thinks it is an existential conflict, based on the unbridled delight the Palestinians show at killing random Jews -- old, young, religious, secular, soldier, civilian, inside the Green Line or outside, it doesn't matter -- and the frankly genocidal messages coming from major Arab organizations such as Hamas and Hizbullah. That the openly expressed desire to destroy Israel and kill the Jews should evoke some hostility in response seems to outrage Ms. Gordon. I have yet to see any of Hamas' offical program -- Destroy Israel and Evict the Jews -- evoke any outrage in the Nation. As usual, only the Jews are treated as responsible for their actions. The rest of the article is a completely false dichotomy between a "pragmatic" Left and the keep-the-territories-forever Right, neither of which exist any more in any numbers. I mean, she might as well claim that American politics today is evenly divided between the Religious Right and the followers of George McGovern. It just has nothing to do with the case. The formerly leftist pragmatists, having been convinced that there is no partner for peace, do not favor negotiations with nobody, and the right has accepted that they cannot keep the territories but are determined not to surrender them to terrorists. The movements Ms. Gordon is talking about have both become fringe movements, noisy but inconsequential. Here is a recent quote from Arik Sharon: Yediot Ahronot’s senior political commentator Shimon Shiffer quotes remarks made by Sharon in a closed meeting. “What does he (Netanyahu) want? To stay in the territories forever? What does he want – to keep this nation recruited for reserve service forever? What does he want – to control 3.5 million Palestinians? Who wants to sit inside their cities anyway?” Hardly the same person as portrayed in the Manichean columns of the left.