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Politics : America Under Siege: The End of Innocence -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Richnorth who wrote (20232)	12/2/2002 8:07:39 AM
From: zonder	Respond to of 27666

Re a very emotional fella that is capable of seeing things only in black or white In my humble opinion, not only is Mr Barry an "emotional fella" but he has little understanding of logic. The particular logical fallacy you are describing and one he uses very often is called a False Dilemma. False Dilemma = "A limited number of options (usually two) is given, while in reality there are more options. A false dilemma is an illegitimate use of the "or" operator. " intrepidsoftware.com

To: Richnorth who wrote (20232)	12/2/2002 6:31:33 PM
From: Machaon	Respond to of 27666

<< Yea, I definitely said that the Jews, after having seen the Holocaust, vowed never to let it happen again. But I definitely did not say they would, after their Holocaust experience, want to wage wars on others (as if to compensate for their passiveness in the past.) Of course, they will have to be aggressive in defending themselves if they were attacked. >> Actually, I agree with you. Looking back at the history of Israel, one can only wonder how an ill equiped, badly trained army, of rag-tag Jewish settlers, was able to defeat the combined, mobilized armies of Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria and Iraq, in 1948. So..... you are right when you say that the Jews had to be aggressive in defending themselves. It was all the more important, since the Arabs have shown throughout history that they murder prisoners.

To: Richnorth who wrote (20232)	12/3/2002 10:12:18 AM
From: Machaon	Respond to of 27666

<< and that they will not take it lying down belly-up as they did in the 1940s. >> History shows an amazing number of people "lying down belly-up". The French and Polish did it when they surrendered to Hitler during WWII. Blacks did it when they meekly went into slavery. Cambodians did when they allowed Pol Pot to massacre about 1/2 of the population. The German people lay down belly-up when they allowed Hitler to destroy most of Europe and Germany. Do you have any more examples of "lying down belly-up"?