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Politics : Formerly About Applied Materials -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: michael97123 who wrote (67067)	12/11/2002 2:57:54 PM
From: BWAC	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 70976

It is THEIR COUNTRY, they should have a right to do whatever they want to do to any invader. And then THEIR COUNTRY will suffer whatever consequences of doing so if they exceed some nefarious "acceptable" civilized standard. I hope none of it happens, in any form. Because I sincerely believe it is all based on a Shrub lie for political gain, and the innocent US soldiers and other such people he will put in harms way will be the ones to suffer the consequence. All 110% unnecessarily. For his attempts at politcal gain. As to past government lies. Not much that can be done about them now in the present. Maybe if people would have questioned the lie a little more back then, and dissenters not been silenced, the lie never would have grown into action. "Fool me once, .......errehh eerr uh duh.. don't fool me again!" Shrub 2002 That past infamous quote seems very appropriate. Especially when you are dealing with the likes of what is running opur government.

To: michael97123 who wrote (67067)	12/11/2002 3:18:35 PM
From: Fred Levine	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 70976

To all --Let's cut out the personal bullshit and focus on our differences and our approaches, Z, BWAC, Mike, & Roll---What would you do if you were Bush? To me, the 1st job is recognition that we're at war with an enemy that can't be reasoned with, and our safety is primary. Having said that, the response cannot be so disproportionate that it creates more enemies than are destroyed. Inevitably enemies will be created, but I would launch a clandestine fight against those involved in Al Quida. In order to do, I would strongly warn any countries that harbor terrorism that they have a responsibility to clean up. The Saudis, I am sure, have been put on notice and I have heard from good sources that the US is actively persuing alternative sources of oil--Angola and Russia. IMO. Bush (who I do think is a moron), has not been strong. However, I was particularly impressed by the killing of leaders in Yemen by remote missle. First, tho, is getting Bin Laden. Bush had him in a cave and let him escape. That is incomprehensible to me. We don't know what efforts are being taken, but the ineptitude is palpable. For the Wall Sreet Journal to buy a computer with documents in a Kabul market is inexcusable. The military should have captured that computer and a lot more. I would also go the extra mile to assure that the world is on our side. IMO, Bush's cowboy approach, has lost him political capital. He cannot appear so bellecose that our allies are afraid of us as much as Iraq. He creates enemies by referring to those who oppose us as being evil, rather than courting them. He's driving many middle-of-the road countries away from us. This is easily corrected by style. E.g., after 9/11, instead of sounding like a cowboy, he should have softly explained that, unfortunately, we are compelled to take measures that are costly in lives, and that Al Quida shouldn't use human sheilds. He sounded too reckless and acted too conservatively-- the exact opposite of what, IMO, should have been done. Mike, altho you trashed my quote from Clinton, that the world would be better off if we loved our common humanity more than we hated our differences, this not only is correct, but would have gained us world support. Now we are generating fear of reckless US actions. We could be loved as a leader in the creation of freedom rather than feared as war mongers. I could go on, but I would love to hear from others. I also want the thread to raise the bar. Stop this silly accusation of motives and personalities. We all share common humanity. fred