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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: KonKilo who wrote (71642)	2/5/2003 10:48:32 PM
From: Maurice Winn	Respond to of 281500

ShilohCat, the peaceful revolution is happening right here. You are in it! These posts. The pictures. The financial and other interest we have in developing cyberspace, which is NOT something owned by somebody. Though the USA, by controlling the key backbone is in the box seat to exert some influence. But it's one of those situations where they can't control it because they need it. More than anyone. Power [and language] stems from community of interest. Cyberspace is forming a huge community of interest. A global one. Mqurice

To: KonKilo who wrote (71642)	2/6/2003 3:46:22 AM
From: KLP	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Well, ShilohCat...We've seen what a few of these folks can do in the past few years..... We certainly ignored it for a long time....(USS Cole, WTC1st time, US Embassies, WTC 2nd, Bali, and all the other etc's....) Ignoring it didn't seem to work. The UN has been containing Iraq (their definition, not mine) for 12 years....his military and weapons continue to grow...Iraq boasts of a 7 MILLION man militia...Mr. Powell outlined some of our knowledge of the WMD he hasn't destroyed, or he would have shown proof of it....ETC ETC.... Would love to hear what you propose doing to rid the world of these mass scale murderers.... Of course there will always be those hardcore cases who want us dead just because we are breathing their air, but there will be far fewer of them than there will be of the kind that can have their behavior modified by intensive stick and carrot techniques.

To: KonKilo who wrote (71642)	2/6/2003 6:19:54 AM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

We haven't even BEGUN to learn how to wage an aggressive peace. No doubt due to a utter lack of alternatives on the part of folks like yourself... All you can do is B&M, without providing a means of "waging peace" and accomplishing the same results. Well Shiloh... I'm all ears. Tell us all how you're going to "wage peace" on Iraq and still enforce those UN resolutions. Because the US presence, and Bush hostile rhetoric is SOLELY RESPONSIBLE for the UN even meeting over the past couple of months to discuss Iraq. Their idea of "waging peace" is to ignore Saddam. To let him get away with violating UN BINDING resolutions. They are willing to appease him, because they are too "civilized" to bring themselves down to his barbaric level.. Well, I tell you what Shiloh... The bible may say "the meek shall inherit the earth", but that's because the good lord is coming with a legion of angels to kick some major bootie here on earth... But until he happens to show up, the "meek shall inherit the sht"... that given a few years and a few billion dollars, we couldn't come up with a truly effective psych-ops based on motivations and rewards.* You haven't got the foggiest idea of what "psy-ops" involves, do you? It involves FEAR. Instilling FEAR... Making the enemy believe you're ready to do something that would not be in their interests. As far as I'm concerned, until we're actually throwing rounds downrange in Iraq, we're involved RIGHT NOW in an incredibly complex psy-ops operation. We're using bluster to make Saddam comply. But when he essentially spits in our face and says "up yours", we have to either follow through with the threat, or back off and suffer international humuliation. If anything, you and your pacifist "waging peace" buddies are the ones engaging in an Iraqi psy-ops operations.. This despotic maniac has convinced you all that he deserves to be defended. That the US is somehow worse than he is. That somehow his regime represents a "sovereign state" rather than an occupied country governed by criminals. Plus there's that enormous foreign aid money pile, ready to be doled out or withheld accordingly. Let me guess... you live in NYC and spend your days paying protection money and bribes to thugs and criminals?? Why do you tell us all where you live so we can come over there and "shake you down" for your lunch money... It's worth it to avoid having your legs broken, right.. :0) Besides, It will be good practice as you learn to "wage peace" on a personal level. We need to think way outside the box here. We're waiting for y'all to put forth your suggestions.... I for one do not wish to pass on to my kids another never-ending war. That's just what you're going to get unless you understand the global dynamics at work here and face the reality that the US must become involved in shaping the future of the Middle East. I'm not eager to take up the task either.. but the alternative is far worse. Hawk