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To: Maurice Winn who wrote (28597)	2/9/2003 6:09:45 PM
From: X Y Zebra	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 74559

I don't know what it was that they did in Belgium to make the meat revolting, but I did away with it I do not know either. However, these days, if I eat meat, it would only be either I would be in BA (Buenos Aires), or from a friend's ranch who raises organic beef, no hormones... other than that, I rarely touch it any more. From reading the rest of the post, it seems we agree... I mean, it's ok to make production efficient (as El Matador was saying), however, I would not compromise quality for either speed or quantity of production. That is why I responded to El Mat. as he was implying that farmed salmon could be as good as wild salmon. There I disagree, farmed salmon has a different taste. it has more fat and it just simply is not the same flavor (as for example, copper river salmon, which is the example I used). Same goes with wine... While not an expert in the specific field, I have read some about wine. The use of sulfites to stop the fermentation of wine (depending on the level of sugar of the grape in any given year and the desired alcohol level), this method to stop fermentation has been used for centuries in the major wine producing countries, i.e. Spain, Italy and France, however, they allow the natural process of fermentation to follow its own pattern as there may be cases in which the use of sulfites is limited. In the US, it seems to me (I have not confirmed this yet, but the evidence points that way), that they use sulfites regardless... they have mechanized the crafting of wine, i.e. they want to stop fermentation on a specific date. The end result is an industrially produced wine, which generally results in headaches (for me), when excess sulfites are used. --the headache could also be that I may be reacting to the tannins in red wines. But I doubt it because with the better wines... I do not get headaches The point of it all (when I started all this) was that I would not like to see the quality of our foods compromise for the sake of optimized production. I would like to see a reduced level of population growth as a balancing event to ease the need to feed a growing population everywhere. Service economy... well... indirectly, the growth of population, particularly the "have nots", (which will probably be those who "serve" you in restaurants)... creates an environment conductive to a form of "slavery" granted not in the Victorian sense... but still a servant with not many choices. As for "voluntary" earning money... I suppose that the other choice would be... voluntarily starve to death if they don't work... -lol It wouldn't be pleasant to have slaves. It's the happy provision of service which is enjoyable. I agree, I would never agree to have slaves... as for "happy provision of service" well, that remains to be seen from whose perspective this happiness emanates... the one providing the service or the one receiving it... -gg ** minor grub... without hormones

To: Maurice Winn who wrote (28597)	2/9/2003 8:11:37 PM
From: elmatador	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 74559

Why the meat isn't good: They didn't feed grass to the cattle. They feed them ground up carcasses, fish meal, bone meal and soybeans feedstock. Please remember that cattle is vegetarian and not omnivorous animals. Those little countries should only import meat form countries that raise cattle extensive. Let loose over thousands of acres. But they raise cattle intensively, i.e., inside a barn feeding the stuff above. They do this because they take money from other sectors of the economy and dump it on these farming schemes. But we are working on these issues. Lula -Brazil's new president- created this catch-phrase "Zero Hungry" in order to force Europeans and North Americans to slow down subsidies to agriculture. Of course his men coated with a paint of ending poverty so that the idea becomes palatable (pun intended). Lets see how it works.