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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: JohnM who wrote (73564)	2/13/2003 12:31:26 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

That sounds as if you consider the post [Hermann's] simply wrong. I certainly wouldn't argue with that, nor with the assertion that we have a great many posts which I consider wrong. But to be wrong is surely not to be anti-semitic. John, there is wrong, and then there is wrong. If I told someone that you lived at 123 Main St when you lived somewhere else, that would be wrong. If I put it about that you had been convicted of molesting your granddaughters when you had never done or been charged with any such thing, that wouldn't just be wrong, it would be slander. Hermann is charging Israel with crimes against humanity without basis. This isn't just wrong, it is slanderous - and it is driven by hatred of the State of Israel. I know you are not making the point that nationalism is coterminous with racism, colonialism, and/or Nazism, but the line reads that way. Care to untangle it for me? I thought you would be familiar by now with the common signs in leftist (anti-war, anti-globo, etc) marches: Zionism=Racism or Zionism=Nazism. The latter formulation is very popular in Europe, where it lets the marchers feel absolved of any lingering guilt for the Holocaust. Zionism never = nationalism, of course, because nationalism is a GOOD THING, while colonialism, racism and Nazism are of course BAD THINGS. re: Perle-Feith-Wolfowitz-are-members-of-the-World-Zionist-Conspiracy. They are working for Israel, not the US. The Jews are behind it all. This is The Protocols of the Elders of Zion tricked out in a new suit. Here is a recent post by scott, with a following exchange between ken, Neocon and paul_philp (inter alia): scott Message 18566660 Neocon Message 18566730 ken Message 18568250 paul siliconinvestor.com The only place I read that seriously argues that [wipe Israel off the map] is in posts you find from jihadists groups in the Arab world. ANSWER argues it too, John. The radical Left has now taken pro-Palestinian anti-Zionism as an article of faith. That's why their platforms have mullahs shouting "Allahu akhbar" but they ban Rabbi Lerner. I guess you can regard this as a "purity" campaign. It reminds me of some other "purity" campaigns I have read of, and it seems to be aiming at rendering the movement Judenrein.

To: JohnM who wrote (73564)	2/13/2003 4:20:19 PM
From: carranza2	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

That sounds as if you consider the post simply wrong. I certainly wouldn't argue with that, nor with the assertion that we have a great many posts which I consider wrong. But to be wrong is surely not to be anti-semitic. That's a bit facile, John. I'm sure you realize that a lot of terribly egregious stuff can be hidden under the "I think it's wrong" mantle. The substantive point worth considering is whether anyone who says that Israel is engaged in ethnic cleansing might be a bit anti-semitic. In order to do so, you must engage in a bit of objective fact-finding to see if the ethnic cleansing allegation is justified. If it's not, and I suggest that it's not, then simply saying "Nadine thinks it's wrong" is begging the question.