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Politics : DON'T START THE WAR -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Ed Huang who wrote (8516)	2/15/2003 12:30:41 PM
From: PartyTime	Respond to of 25898

I don't know. I'm surprised we haven't seen him check in, as the peace demonstrations very much have been a past contribution he's made to this thread. Whatever happened to the guy who wrote Post Number One on this thread? Message 18395210

To: Ed Huang who wrote (8516)	2/15/2003 12:46:05 PM
From: PartyTime	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 25898

More than one million march in London: portal.telegraph.co.uk Over a million take to the streets (Filed: 15/02/2003) More than one million people have staged an anti-war protest in London, making it the UK's largest ever peace demonstration. <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2003/02/15/umarch.jpg> The march in progress Hundreds of thousands of campaigners crammed into Hyde Park for a mass rally to voice opposition to a conflict with Iraq. The turnout dwarfed the 400,000-strong countryside march which took place last year. An ever-growing sea of people gathered around a specially constructed stage to listen to rousing speeches by politicians, pop stars and campaigners. Waving banners and flags, protesters cheered and shouted as speakers put across the case against war. Former Labour Cabinet minister Mo Mowlam joined others including veteran campaigner Tony Benn and Liberal Democrat leader Charles Kennedy. She told the crowds: "Things can only get better if we stick together." And she said: "Keep it peaceful. Because being peaceful, people will have no excuse not to listen. The noisy but good natured protest was peaceful so far, with Scotland Yard reporting just three arrests. Two men aged 31 and 32 were detained for public order offences. One 47-year-old man was detained for possession of an offensive weapon and racist material after being arrested in Whitehall Place. They remain in custody. A digital screen on the Hyde Park stage reported that the numbers of people on the march had risen to two million. Scotland Yard was unable to confirm exact figures at present, but said the numbers ran into hundreds of thousands. Organiser John Rees said the turnout was fantastic. "It's an electric atmosphere but also very serious and determined. It's not just a question of war and peace," he said. It's a question of whether the Government is willing to abide by the majority of the people." Stop the War Coalition, which organised the march, had predicted that it would be the broadest grassroots mobilisation in British history, dwarfing anti-Vietnam rallies of the 1960s and peace rallies in the 1980s. London Mayor Ken Livingstone and campaigner Bianca Jagger also took to the stage and are expected to be followed later by popstars Damon Albarn and Ms Dynamite. <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2003/02/15/ustop.jpg> Protestors make their way down Piccadilly The streets of central London remained full to the brim as people continued to try to reach the park. More than 4,500 officers were on duty lining the roads, as protesters passed by cheering, shouting, sounding horns, banging drums and waving signs saying No War On Iraq and Make Tea, Not War. Roads along the route were closed and all police leave was cancelled to cope with the march. Coaches from all corners of the country began descending on London in the early hours, bringing together people from across the social spectrum. The march, which began at two meeting points at Embankment on the Thames and Gower Street, was started early by police due to the swelling numbers. When the two strands finally met in Piccadilly Circus there were deafening cheers from the thousands who gathered around the statue of Eros. The march strolled past some of the capital's most famous landmarks, including the Houses of Parliament and Big Ben. Giancarlo Suella, 29, a student from Rome, led the protesters into Hyde Park holding a banner which read: "Bush And Blair, A Good Christian Will Never Kill". At Piccadilly, one of the youngest protesters, Rory Budd, nine, from Walthamstow, east London, carried a placard bigger than himself which read "No" in giant letters. Asked what he thought about Mr Blair, Rory, who was with his father Dermot, said: "He's the only one who wants to go to war. I don't want it." In Glasgow, organisers said around 61,000 protesters marched through the city centre towards the Scottish Exhibition and Conference Centre, where the Labour party's spring conference was being held. A spokeswoman said it was the biggest protest the city had seen since anti-poll tax demonstrations in March 1990. Tony Blair said in a message to the demonstrators: "I rejoice that we live in a country where peaceful protest is a natural part of our democratic process. "But I ask the marchers to understand this: I do not seek unpopularity as a badge of honour. But sometimes it is the price of leadership and the cost of conviction." The rally was co-ordinated by the Stop the War Coalition with more than 450 organisations affiliating themselves to the coalition including Greenpeace, the Liberal Democrats, Plaid Cymru and the SNP Jacques More, 44, a writer from Croydon, south London, mounted a lone protest outside the Iraqi section of the Jordanian embassy in central London, holding a placard proclaiming his support of military action to bring down Saddam Hussein. And in Italy today, one million peace protesters - wrapped in rainbow peace flags and shrieking slogans against a war on Iraq - flooded central Rome. <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> 14 February 2003: 25,000 in Glasgow march <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> 13 February 2003: Peace march 'could attract half a million' <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> 13 February 2003: Blair's moral war to save 'innocent Iraqis' <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> 11 February 2003: BBC ban on marchers <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> 4 February 2003: Minister retreats over war march ban <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/core/images/trany.gif> <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/box_line.gif> Related reports <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> The speakers <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> In today's Telegraph <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/box_line.gif> External links <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> Stop the War Coalition <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> An open letter to the people of Europe - Alternet <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> Press briefing [14 Feb '03] - 10 Downing Street <http://www.portal.telegraph.co.uk/stylesheets/news/images/bullet.gif> Media Workers Against War

To: Ed Huang who wrote (8516)	2/15/2003 1:15:17 PM
From: Crimson Ghost	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 25898

US and Europe march to different drumbeats E-mail this Print this Claude Salhani, UPI 14 February 2003 WASHINGTON, Feb. 14 (UPI) -- The crisis over Iraq has widened the philosophical divide between the United States and some of its traditional European allies, chilling alliances that have survived decades of Cold War, otherwise unscathed. Many in the United States were quick to point accusing fingers, and to throw vitriolic accusations at the Europeans, particularly at the French for their anti-war stance. One particularly inane bumper sticker was seen to say, "Bomb Iraq then bomb France." There is no humor here. In fact, it is outright frightening to believe that intransigence in this case could have sunk to such low levels. In his haste to offer "proof" of Saddam's links to Osama bin Laden, Secretary of State Colin Powell turned to the recently released audio tape by the master terrorist that was aired on the Qatari-based television channel, al Jazeera earlier this week. Yet in the tape, bin Laden clearly takes Saddam to task, accusing him of being an "infidel." Says bin Laden about Saddam's regime, "the socialists and the rulers have lost their legitimacy a long time ago, and the socialists are infidels regardless of where they are, whether in Baghdad or in Aden." This does not seem to deter the Bush administration who continues to march to the beat of war drums regardless of what the rest of the world feels, or for that matter, what the millions of Americans who will take to the streets of several U.S. cities this weekend in protest of the war believe. "Our Congress has turned into the Roman Senate in the last days of the Republic. The president has adopted what amounts to imperial powers to make war," said Rashid Khalidi, a professor of history at the University of Chicago. Yet, while the majority of Europeans remain vehemently opposed to a war with Iraq, it is important to stress that these Euro-sentiments do not reflect anti-Americanism in Europe. They only reflect growing anti-Bush administration feelings by the majority of Europeans. The bad news here is that many Americans took the president at his word when he said shortly after Sept. 11, 2001, "You are either with us, or against us." Unfortunately -- or rather, fortunately -- the world of politics is never that clear-cut. Truth be told, the fact that the majority of Europeans are with America was clearly demonstrated after the terror attacks on New York and the Pentagon. The outpour of sympathy from the "old Europe," was unequivocal. France's authoritative newspaper, Le Monde, heralded on Sept. 12, the day after the attacks, "Nous sommes tous Americains" -- "We are all Americans." Aside from Islamic fundamentalists, I think it is quite safe to assume that no one in Europe loves Saddam Hussein. They would all be glad to see him go. They just differ over the methods. France particularly, being the country that has played a central role in the establishment of the declaration of human rights and welcomed political refugees from around the globe, and especially from the Arab world, is well positioned to recognize a dictatorial regime when it sees one. Yes, France can be accused of having done business with Saddam's Iraq. But then, so has the United States and Italy, among other civilized nations. If France helped Saddam build his nuclear reactor in Osirak, which Israel destroyed in 1981, likewise, the U.S. can be accused of having provided Iraq with chemical weapons during the Iraq-Iran war in 1979. The current divergences between the "old Europe" and the United States should be allowed to rise above the level of name-calling as some newspapers in the United States have taken to do. "Wimps," "axis of weasels" and "cheese-eating surrender monkeys," screamed editorials and anti-French, German and Belgian articles, which one paper called "a country that is little more than a mini-me minion." Those throwing foul names and accusations would do well to heed the words of caution Powell offered after Friday's U.N. Security Council meeting, regarding dealing with France. Said Powell: "As you only do it with a friend of 225 years, you do it with respect." Claude Salhani is a senior editor with United Press International. Comments may be sent to claude@upi.com Copyright (c) 2001-2003 United Press International