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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: JohnM who wrote (75949)	2/20/2003 12:02:19 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Those demonstrations were about the proper exercise of American power So you agree it's not really about Saddam? and Bush has convinced large portions of the globe that he will not do so. The contrast with Clinton is remarkable. Oh, for goodness sake, John, 95% of Clinton's foreign policy was a game of kick-the-can-down-the-road. Paper problems over, don't rock the boat, keep diplomatic processes moving for the sake of process, and talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, talk. Small wonder the Europeans loved him. They too love process for its own sake. Where Clinton did try to do anything - such as the "Mideast Peace Process" he was animated by his core belief that he can talk anyone into anything. Well, 'tain't so.

To: JohnM who wrote (75949)	2/20/2003 12:10:25 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 281500

No, Nadine, something called The Left did not oppose the Afghan war. Your evidence is (a) a New York Times report which was about means not ends (and I'll have to check with conspiracy central to see if the Times counts as "the left); as for British papers, the quotes you offer are also about means, not ends. You'll have to do better than that. John, this is really lame. I could go back on this thread and dig up what everybody said, but frankly, it's not worth my time. The Left (which the NYTimes is a part of, in everybody's eyes but yours and your Naderite cousins) opposed the war. To say that they didn't oppose the war, they just opposed a military attack on the Taliban - "means, not end" - is pure sophistry. The opponents of the Afghan War didn't have much political ground to stand on in the wake of 9/11, so they just wailed about quagmires and humanitarian crises in front of the war and cooked up figures about how many thousands of civilians we had killed after the war. But the pictures of the citizens of Kabul dancing for joy and begging the soldiers to stay forever were kind of embarrassing for them.