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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Greg or e who wrote (34440)	3/4/2003 10:42:30 PM
From: Berry Picker	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Greg - you ask me question and expect an honest answer. Why do you expect of me what you have refused me thus far? Are your questions aimed at an honest discussion or are they the same spirit as the Pharisess who asked Christ questions to "tempt" and trap him? Matthew 19:3 The Pharisees also came unto him, tempting him, and saying unto him, Is it lawful for a man to put away his wife for every cause? John 8:6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not. (perhaps I should have continued ignoring you?) Were those questions coming from righteous men seeking a righteous discussion Greg? Do not answer that question - you already answered it: RE>>If you answer them honestly then people will see what it is that sets you apart from Christianity<< You expect my questions to set me apart from Christianity... by whose definition Greg? - don't answer that one either :-) I will answer your questions Greg - but to say my answers will prove that I am not of Christ will be yet another evil accusation on your part. Question #1 "What happens to your body when you die Brian?" Open any grave for an answer to that question Greg. It rots and turns back to the dust even as God declared it must. Except of course if you happen to die because you were eaten by an animal or a cannibal. Then your body truns into food energy or dung upon the ground. The dung may however also be classified as food energy for other creatures or for plants who change the chemicals of what was your body into plant parts to suit their existence until they die. Now if you doubt this Greg - go and open a grave of someone who died 100 years ago or so... Don't get caught however it is illegal. You will find dust. The body returns to dust Greg - short answer. Genesis 3:19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. Question #2 "Why (according to you) did Jesus rise in His physical body but then returned in 70 A.D. in a non-physical body?" Why ? I do not know why. Why did Jesus send Peter to catch a fish with a coin in it's belly instead of killing a sheep with a coin in it's body? God does what He wills because He will it. BUT - I have never adamantly stated that Jesus did not return in a physical body - but scripture and other concepts have made it difficult to believe that He did. 1 John 3:2 for one. You do not seem to be able to sit down long enough and free yourself from your dogma long enough to even 'understand' what that verse teaches. You and thousands like you insist that all men will be resurrected in the same body that was "planted" If that was so plain why did the "original" church ( not early church ) the church that had the benefit of the preaching and instructions of Paul and John not understand it? Why was this question being asked?: 1 Corinthians 15:35 ¶ But some one will say, <B?How are the dead raised? and with what manner of body do they come? Now if what you and all the REAL CHRISTIANS are right then all Paul had to say was... They will be raised with the same body they had when they died only glorified even as Christ was resurrected? That takes about ONE VERSE would you not say? Why does Paul take from verse 35 to verse 55 to explain what you and others like you find so simple? Why does John not know what the resurrected body will be like in 1 John 3:2? If we will be like Christ and Christ returns in the same resurrected form in which He left? I asked a fellow the other day a rather simple question. He had no answer but became very very angry with me for asking. Why is it that people can not handle even questioning those traditions that are handed down from men and yet laugh at how foolish the pharisees were when they did the same? Where are the Berians of today? I asked this fellow this... If men have entertained angel unaware - then did those angels have physical bodies while visiting those men. His answer was - they must have had or else those people would know right away that they were angels. So then I asked him if he thought those angels alway had those bodies or if they assumed them while they visited here on earth. His answer was that they assumed them but in heaven did not have them. Then I asked him if he thought that Jesus - who is God - would take on the body of a man and then be confined to it throughout eternity? At that point the guy lost it and started asking me why I always have to think about such strange things and why can't I just be like everyone else? He was sincerely angry... I told him that I do not see any harm in questioning things and asked him why people get so angry whenever someone dares to ask questions about God and belief systems. I would ask you the same thing Greg Are asking me to believe that Jesus who is God and lived throughout eternity as a spirit being, has now confined himself to a physical body throughout all eternity? Did Christ not "take on" a body and become man as part of His "humiliation" being made a 'little lower than the angels' so that He could suffer the cross as the sacrifice for the sins of the elect. Hebrews 2:9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man. You see Greg Jesus WAS past tense made lower than the angels IN ORDER THAT He could suffer death 'physically' for every man that should be saved. Are angels free from bodies and Christ constrained to one? It the Father and the Holy Spirit now different in nature than the Son? Will Christ never return to His former Glory in Heaven? These are questions - they prove nothing - but niether do your blind assertions. Who have not proven ever that Christ must return physically nor have you proven that the dead were risen physically yet you claim that not believing your unproven stuff condemns a man to hell. Interesting or just more stuff from the flesh? I can ask and surmise forever - it proves nothing. Your insistance about a physical resurrection proves nothing. SCRIPTURE ALONE must settle all debate. John said that when Christ returned they would be just like Him but that he did not know what that would be like. Paul said this in answer to the question "With what body shall the dead be raised..." 1 Cor 15:37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, How does that teach that we will have the same body that was planted 6 feet under Greg? It appears to any reasonable soul that one may doubt your position on that comment alone. It appear Paul is not endorsing your idea at ALL.. 1 Cor 15:40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. In those verse Greg Paul is teaching that their are different kinds of bodies. Why teach that if we get the same body we died with. My wife told me she definately does not want the body she dies with :-) I am missing a few fingers Greg - will I get my 20 year old body or a glorified old man's body? You know what Greg - I don't care what kind of body I get. I look forward to the forgiveness of Christ and the eternal state. I am fully confident that whatsoever kind of body God choses to give me after my demise will be just GREAT !!! Paul also says this: 1 Cor 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is a different glory - it is a different body not the same is what the apostle Paul taught Greg. 1 Cor 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. Why is my believing that we are given spiritual bodies anti-christ in your mind? Physical bodies do not inherit the kingdom Greg. Their is no 'millenium' and the 'rapture' is already past. 50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Flesh and blood = physical earthly bodies. The saducees did not believe there was such a thing as the resurrection. They saw it though carnal eyes even as you do. They tempted Christ with this: Matthew 22:25 Now there were with us seven brethren: and the first, when he had married a wife, deceased, and, having no issue, left his wife unto his brother: 26 Likewise the second also, and the third, unto the seventh. 27 And last of all the woman died also. 28 Therefore in the resurrection whose wife shall she be of the seven? for they all had her. Those men looked for a return to this kind of life. Physical bodies, likely having sex seeing that they expected marriage. They looked for a carnal kingdom like the one many expect in the so-called millenium. They were not thinking in a spiritual realm but an earthly realm. They believed they had asked a question that ruled out resurrection because how could she have 7 husbands and none of them could be divorced having died any not sinned in adultery. If their premises about resurrection had been right then their question was unanswerable but Christ corrected them Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God. Matthew 22:30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven. Christ taught that they were to become as angels. Even you will not try to assert that resurrected saints will continue as they were on earth with sexual desires and seeking toilet tissue on sale a drug mart? Did Christ use a washroom on earth? After being resurrected did Christ build one in heaven? Just how far do you want to carry your SAMENESS DOCTRINE Greg? Sorry Greg - got to go... work to get done tonight. Spelling mistakes and all - this is all I have time for. Will galdly and boldly and publicly answer your other questions Greg - I am just out of time tonight. Brian