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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: 2MAR$ who wrote (34459)	3/6/2003 6:56:28 AM
From: Berry Picker	Respond to of 39621

Mars: RE>>but when you bold or italicize parts of my posts , try not to include parts of your former posts alonside with mine , to make them seem homogenous . << Mars - I am not interested in changing the meaning of what anyone has said. Twisting anothers words to 'attempt' to 'win' is dishonest and and reveals a very self centered mentality. If I have done this then I am sorry. I usually highlite what someone else has said to focus on a particular aspect of what they said. Conclusions are rarely made up of a single presupposition. False conclusion can be based upon 99% truth and but 1% error. I highlite what someone else has said in an attempt to get to the "root of the problem" I am going on a little business trip for a week and have been stressed to get everything done as of late. It is now 4 in the morning and I am up without sleep :-) Your world view is opposite to mine Mars: RE>>The world would have gone on , with or without a Jesus or the Jew or a "Christ" , and that is the the ultimate thing obvious for anyone to see. If Jesus had never been born , never risen , never came the second time around , there would have been another "Christ" , I assure you , and the sun would have come up just the same the next morning.<< I just highlighted that as an example. You do not understand what the scriptures teach about God. It is not possible for the sun to rise no-matter-what. That is NOT the God of the Bible. Acts 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring. "In Him we move" I do not believe the SUN orbits on it's own. I do not believe that God wound up the world like a clock and set it in it's own motion. I do not believe that men make decisions that God has not ordained. Acts 2:23 Him, being delivered by the derminate counsel and foreknowledge of GOD, YOU have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: The previous verse teaches that there is no possible way that Christ could not have come as well as there was no possible wat that Christ would not be rejected by the Jews. "determinate counsel" is to absolutely predestinate That is the GOD part of that verse. The YOU part referred to the JEWS as a corporate identity a part of whom were THEN listening to these words actually being spoken and figuratively applies to all men who are no better in thought and deed than those very very religious Jews. That is the hidden ME part of it. Now futurists who butcher scripture fail to maintain those kinds of distinctions when reading scripture and yet accuse me of heresy? Absolute Predestination Another thing that is taught within both that verse and all of scripture is that God Predestines events both good and bad to occur. Adam was ordained to fall into sin. Judas was ordained to betray the Christ. Those who will be saved are ordained to "accept" the gospel. Those who are truly born of the Holy Spirit see the truth of scripture and the ultimate differences between the wisdom contained there and the foolish notions that are passed off as wisdom in all other man made religions. Here is the hard part for someone outside looking in. Among all the man-made religions - false 'christianity' also exists. Men who accuse Christianity of being false have a lot of directions to point their fingers IF those many false movements represented Christianity. In fact - I would not be a Christian myself if that were a means of legitimate truth. I would have to say that one of the primary evidences that a man is truly saved is his attitude toward scripture. You Mars are not saved - it is evident. RE>>I see it quite differently as a work of lierature<< To you the bible is just another book and Jesus is just another prophet. Matthew 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. 17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. The above statement is in a nutshell what "born-again" is supposed to mean Mars. Many who speak about being "born-again" talk about having mader a decision in their "flesh and blood" WILL. That is because so many false preachers exist and have existed. This is also ordained and predestinated of God. It is meant to be - it is not some satanic victory. God never intended for Adam to remain - God predestined His Son to enter the world and be rejected before God built the world at all. Revelation 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. "foundation of the world" is a time statement not a location. 1 Peter 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you, "last times" refers to the last days that God was going to allow Israel to exist as a nation as prophesied by Dan and others "for you" applied specifically to the saved souls that Peter was writing to but in a general sense ... well your a bright fellow I think you can get it. Re>>You are a Christ-Hater , if you question the divine authority of The Scritpture<< Mars - perhaps this will help even if you do not believe it. The Christian view is - Adam fell and as corporate 'head' of mankind inherited death for all men. Adam died spiritually "in that day" but physically he was doomed to begin with. All men then born of him are like him - dead in sin. Christ was concieved of the Holy Ghost ( not of the dust ) He was not dead spiritually and did not cave to satan or the lusts of the flesh. Yet Christ did die "physically" even as Adam but as a "sacrifice" unto God and did not "see corruption" (rot) Psalms 16:10 For thou wilt not leave my soul in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption. 'my' = Jesus not David God ordained that this "sacrifice" would satisfy His demands of righteousness and obedience to His revealed will for all those He chose to "impute" this gift to ( not all men ) Thus some are saved but nost are not - that is God's will as revealed by scripture. Most people hate that and it is no wonder - as they are still in their flesh and the flesh is at emnity to God. God made Moses but even your ying/yang nonsense will allow you to see that God also made Pharoah. Yes you are right Mars - Those who attack the scripture are still under the spiritual death inherited in the "first Adam" Those who are adopted into the family of God under the "second Adam" (Christ) are convinced of the verity the scriptures alone. All men in their flesh are "Christ haters" even those who are saved. It is an absolute dichotomy The true ying and yang. Right vrs wrong The created vrs the Creator Romans 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.