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To: mishedlo who wrote (5489)	3/8/2003 4:31:14 PM
From: LTK007	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 11447

DAMMIT !!! Mish your Facking losing your best Facking ALLY with this total preachy pretension better than you total CRAP!!!!!!!!!!!! Wake up!!!! You are getting into FANATIC land when you are FAUCKING blind to recognize your friends from your foes. I consider your last series of post outrageously insulting, and to hell with you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Max P.S. You who FACKING know NOTHING of what it is to REALLY pay the price of his convictions.(i do!). You are so facking full of yourself you haven't even caught any references i have given to my past.And that is unforgivable!!!!!

To: mishedlo who wrote (5489)	3/9/2003 2:43:37 PM
From: mishedlo	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 11447

Burden of Proof Let's start with a few things hopefully we can all agree on. 1) Hussein is evil and no doubt has tortured some of his own people. 2) Hussein may be hiding some chemical weapons 3) Iraq is weakened militarily since the last war 4) Iraq is weakened economically since the last war 5) There is no proof Hussein has nuclear weapons. 6) There is no proof Hussein has a current nuclear program. 7) There is every reason to believe that he that although Hussein wanted nuclear weapons, there is no proof that he is remotely close to having either the technology, the plants, the centrifuges, the PROPER magnets or even the uranium. 8) Hussein has not attacked another country for 10 years. 9) Hussein in its current state is no match for US military power. 10) Hussein currently provides no credible DIRECT military threat to the US. 11) Iraq has oil, lots of it. 12) The US is worried about oil supplies as well as price because high oil prices COULD sink our economy back into recession. 13) Inspections are proceeding slower than everyone might like. 14) Some progress towards disarmament (even if it is slow) is being made. 15) Under international law there are no grounds for a US assualt on Iraq right now. 16) The UN has not authorized the US of force against Iraq 17) Iraq is in violation of nummerous UN resolutions. 18) Israel and other countries are in violation of numerous UN resolutions. 19) As a matter of policy, the UN decides what the repercussions are for violation of UN resolutions, not the US. 20) World sentiment appears to be against a war without UN approval 21) The US economic costs for this war are unknown and could be very high. 22) The US has not budgeted the costs for this war. 23) Bin Laden has stated that one of the primary grounds for the WTC attack was US troops on sacred Arab soil. 24) It is POSSIBLE that terrorism MAY increase if we invade Iraq. 25) It is impossible to know in advance all the potential ramifications if things go badly in the war or the aftermath of the war. 26) The US threatened Iraq with first use of nuclear weapons. 27) civilian casualties could be extremely high (see 26). 28) If we attack Iraq we simply do no know how long our troops might have to stay in Iraq, or at what cost. I could go on but that is enough. As stated, does anyone on either side disagree with any of those 28 points? If so why? I am trying to be fair here in a statement of facts. I am very careful in choice of words here so as to be factual as opposed to voicing an opinion. Hopefully we can all agree on most if not all of those facts and I do mean facts, not conjecture, not hypothesis, not opinion. Facts are presented for both sides. Perhaps there are more FACTS for the case for war, but I do not want to see Hussein killed millions, Hussein gassed 10's of thousands of his own people, Hussein wants to kill 2 million US civilians or any other such nonsense to the list. Given the facts presented above, how can anyone truly believe the case for war is overwhelming? Now I will offer a couple of opinions in the form of a questions: a) Shouldn't the case for war be overwhelming based on FACTS not supposition of hiding things, supposition of alleged ties to Al Qaeda, supposition of this that and other things? b) If the US is allowed to preemptively take out another country on suppositions, why shouldn't North Korea, Pakistan, or India have the same right. M