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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: 2MAR$ who wrote (34561)	3/23/2003 6:27:44 PM
From: Jamey	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 39621

Mars, the absence of grace abounds also. Paul, who wrote 2/3 of the New Testament says it well. Romans 7:14-25 14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin. 15 For what I am doing, I do not understand. For what I will to do, that I do not practice; but what I hate, that I do. 16 If, then, I do what I will not to do, I agree with the law that it is good. 17 But now, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find. 19 For the good that I will to do, I do not do; but the evil I will not to do, that I practice. 20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. 21 I find then a law, that evil is present with me, the one who wills to do good. 22 For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. 23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. 24 O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? 25 I thank God--through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin." The difference in the Christian and the unsaved is that their sins are covered by the blood of Christ. Once saved, always saved. James

To: 2MAR$ who wrote (34561)	3/24/2003 10:25:11 AM
From: Berry Picker	Respond to of 39621

You make a good and undeniable point Mars. One against which I can say nothing... RE>>"all I have usually seen here is much ignorance , strife , petty argument and name calling among such loving Christians . One thing to talk about "Grace" ...another thing to have it .<< Christ said this: Matthew 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: This is the #1 reason Christianity ( functional ) has become irrelevant. The only saving "grace" is that the Bible and Christ are true regardless of the inexcusable ignorance of it's followers be they true or false in heart. Paul said this: Galatians 5:15 But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another. Christianity has been a blood bath for the most part burning and torturing those who stand against the 'church' doctrines and stand up for what the bible actually teaches. It is a sad affair that there are so many who profess Christ and yet persecute the truth and those who stand for it. However - this has always been the case. It was the church that CRUCIFIED CHRIST!!! Theologians have long understood that there is an 'invisible' and true church as well as a 'visible' and mixed bag of tricks church. The true church to some extent operates within the visible church but suffers the fact that within it are both wheat and tares. It would be nice if it were possible to differentiate between the sincere and the insincere or between the elect and non-elect but it is not easy as even the elect suffer from the deeds of the flesh as James so 'graciously' pointed out to you. I do not see you as sincere. You seem to think you are in a position to judge who is lacking Grace. YOU ARE NOT You would also judge Christ Himself as lacking grace when He treated those insincere Pharisees, as any man should. The game you are playing is the one that works best with most Christians however - so do not let me discourage you in your ungodly efforts. Christians are suckers. They will fall for the "I must love him at all costs" mentality until you have beaten them black and blue and then some. They will actually think they are serving God by hanging around for untold amounts of abuse. They think they can "Love you into the kingdom" This is the devil's greatest game and you seem quite prepared to continue on with it. I am not writing this for your benefit. It is for the benefit of anyone who has enough wisdom to come out of such ridiculous teachings. Christ said this: Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; This is the word of God and is true. However when asked - "What is meant by love" or "How does one 'love' their enemies" Most are lost for answer and fall pray to your demands for grace. Christians and Christ OWE YOU NOTHING We are completely free to ignore your sorry soul. You have received an ABUNDANCE OF GRACE You are just too blind to see it. One of those graces may even be my LONG POSTS explaining ANYTHING to you. LIFE IS NOT ON YOUR TERMS YOU SPOILED BRAT !! Prove to me you deserve to even be acknowledged as existing by any of us. You deserve nothing - demanding grace is not your place. Grace is Grace - it is not wages that are owed to you. Grace is OWED to NO ONE - not you - not James - not me. Tell me the truth - your questions were not 'tactical' in nature? If you are sincerely seeking truth.... Go read the bible 'prayerfully' and stop screwing around.