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Politics : Moderate Forum -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: The Philosopher who wrote (810)	4/29/2003 2:44:18 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 20773

Well, by all means, let's have armed gunmen raid every ethnic restaurant in the county, on the pretext that they might uncover a plot. Frankly, you could have lived in the former USSR with the KGB protecting you, if you wanted to live like that. Do you want to live like that? I think a few lives are a small price to pay for freedom. You are willing to spend lives freely enough in war- why not spend them in peacetime, in order to have a more free and open society. You cannot be perfectly safe and have any degree of freedom.

To: The Philosopher who wrote (810)	4/30/2003 9:15:16 AM
From: zonder	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 20773

To me, the most disturbing elements of the incident was not that the people in the restaurant were detained for a couple of hours and were hence inconvenienced, but the manner in which they were held. I would have to be brought down to the station and await security clearance before being granted one [a lawyer]. When I asked how long that would take, he replied with a coy smile: "Maybe a day, maybe a week, maybe a month." One of the policemen walked over with his hand on his gun and taunted: "Go ahead and leave, just go ahead." I was questioned over the fact that my license was out of state, and asked if I had "something to hide." The police continued to hassle the kitchen workers, demanding licenses and dates of birth. Nor have the over 600 people of South Asian descent currently being held without charge by the Federal government. Apparently, this type of treatment is acceptable. One of the taxi drivers, a U.S. citizen, spoke to me during the interrogation. "Please stop talking to them," he urged. "I have been through this before. Please do whatever they say. Please for our sake." Message 18894018 The military personnel who raided this restaurant could be more civil, more protective of and less threatening towards the American citizens in the restaurant, and still "uncover and prevent a plot" to blow up the building in which your father work. Their right to a lawyer could be within 24 hours rather than "maybe a day, a week, or a month", and your father's building would still be saved. The difference is that such would be the norm in a democratic country where the individual has rights recognized by the state, which cannot be erased at the whim of military personnel with guns.