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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: bela_ghoulashi who wrote (100620)	6/7/2003 5:11:04 PM
From: captain_midnite	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

While I completely agree with the gist of your post, specifically the baseless hyperbole and sophomoric notions of that poster's comments, your tone is unacceptable. Your ad hominem attack and expletives do no service to the thread as a whole, and distract from your actual message. It seems the signal-noise around here is at new lows. I sometimes wonder what happened to the "discussion" part of FADG. It has apparently been replaced by bluster, insults, and arrogance. I'd reconsider your comments. The language of your post will be the issue, instead of the ridiculous comments to which you were responding. Ignorance should not be met with intolerance, one is left with garbage at both ends.

To: bela_ghoulashi who wrote (100620)	6/7/2003 10:43:17 PM
From: Jacob Snyder	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

<Who had "the freedom" in Iraq in six months ago?> Nobody did. And nobody does now, either. One all-powerful military dictator, who ruled without the "consent of the governed", has been replaced by another (foreign) dictator. <What "seeds of good" were blooming like madness everywhere in Iraq that were stifled by the United States > None. None at all. Which, as Kant explains eloquently, is not an excuse for invasion. <How could any "despotism", of any stripe, be any more soulless than one that was already in place?> When we went into Afghanistan, I thought nothing could be worse than the Taliban. But we managed to do it, replacing organized tyranny with chaotic tyranny. Kant speaks directly to these points, why don't you read him, in the passages I just posted. <You are a complete fucking idiot.> I say things that challenge your dearly held Myths. Bland, the feeling is mutual, I normally have you on ignore too. But a while ago, I took everyone off ignore. Then, Michael went back on ignore, because of a highly emotional PM sans content. If you answer this post, by saying anything like "you are such an absolute thumb-sucking moron", I'll put you back on Ignore. Kant, an Enlightenment philosopher I hadn't read before, was brought up (not by me), so I spent some time reading him. Turns out, he made (200+ years ago) a very specific plan for World Peace, which has a lot in common with what I have been proposing. You may find it insulting and irritating, to be told that the US's foreign policy has been imperialism, since 1898, and has brought a lot more tyranny than freedom, in that 105-year time span, to the globe. For every Germany, there are 20 or 30 Afghanistans and Chiles and Vietnams. You may feel a lot more comfortable, discussing the American Myth with other Believers, the Myth where MightMakesRight, and the U.S. Army is the hero of every story. But this Myth is starkly at odds, with the overwhelming opinion, of the 96% of the planet that are not U.S. citizens. Even if you include the AngloSphere and Israel, it's still a tiny minority who take the American Myth seriously. Anger is not a useful response to my opinions. Neither is ignoring it, or ridicule, or dismissing it contemptuously. Whether you like it or not, my view of American foreign policy is overwhelmingly more prevalent than yours, in about 190 of the world's 200 nations. For proof, go review the latest Pew global poll. For further proof, look at previous polls, and notice the trend. Bin Laden is seen far more favorably than Bush is, on the battleground of the WarOnTerroristsAndEveryoneElseWhoTalksBack. That's not merely my opinion, it a simple fact. America has to deal with that, if we are going to win the war, and is going to have to find a more useful response, than anger and ridicule.