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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Sully- who wrote (106590)	7/20/2003 1:12:34 AM
From: Graystone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Do you believe that ? or Canada, France, Germany, Russia, India, China Do you believe that this list represents countries that are "with the terrorists" Do you expect that there are readers who are naive enough to believe that you believe this ? Should anyone actually believe this ? Why are you insisting on making George Bush look like a fool, would it not be better if he used the words "against us" rather than "with the terrorists" Which do you prefer "bring it on" or "bring them on" Are you in the army ?

To: Sully- who wrote (106590)	7/20/2003 1:27:55 AM
From: marcos	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

We gave him the benefit of the doubt that day, let it go as rhetorical device .... it was The Day After, we were all allied then ... all of us, all of the Rest of Us in the independent democracies and in the near-democracies and in many a democracy-to-be, we had every one of us been attacked by murdering religious whackos .... those towers were a powerful image, twenty-four canadians died there, the number of mexicanos murdered is unknown still but each one counts large ..... these are my two nations, there were seventy-eight other nations including the US who took casualties that day from bloodthirsty religious scum We had all been attacked together, we were all allied together So we did Afghanistan, where the whackos had been hiding out, poof and that was done, and a good thing too We all worked together to cut off funds to organisations we'd overlooked before, our police forces worked together sharing information, we all stepped up security, coordinated our efforts in myriad ways .... perfectly reasonable stuff this, as to fight crime is clearly a good thing, and together we can fight it better Then your PNAC bunch decided to slip in something they'd worked up in the back rooms of Washington previously, something tenously peripheral to the effort against terror - an invasion of Iraq ... and it had to be just the way they wanted an invasion, on just the day they picked to invade, and they would control it in every way .... they would permit no discussion, they would look at no alternatives in style of invasion nor in timing nor in anything, they would have their little war their way, and that's that ... and they said to us directly, to each and every nation, using bribery and threats - you are with us or you are against us So we said back to them, screw you, if forced to pick we must then take the latter, as you are being dickheads on this issue, fortunately your either/or choice is bogus and given your attitude we want nothing to do with your project du jour, so just piss off and when you've got human beings running your regime, have them call us ... the various diplomats would likely have used other terms, i'm sure, but that's the message pahdnuh .... if you want any hope of selling us on cooperation ever again with that dictatorial neocon bunch in Washington, you can tell them from us they better smarten t.f.u. .... no wait, let's make it plain and simple for them, tell them this straight out - They are either with us, or they are against us.

To: Sully- who wrote (106590)	7/20/2003 4:11:19 AM
From: GST	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

In speech after speech, Bush said "you are with us or against us". Only in one speech did he say "Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists." Bush is so fond of saying "you are with us or you are against us" it is probably his most often used phrase. I could not bother to count all the speeches where he used that phrase -- the White House web site has over 11,000 references to it and there are 157 newspaper references to it. He even uses that expression to explain what he meant in the Sept 20 speech.