SI
SI
discoversearch

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor.  We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community.  If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.
Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Dayuhan who wrote (109019)7/31/2003 7:22:09 AM
From: LindyBill  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
I know that there are schools in India just to learn "CNN English." And I am not surprised at your comments about Filipino kids learning English as a first language. Only in America is learning English despised. I think you will get a kick out of this blogger from Afghanistan.

MORE NEWS FROM AFGHANISTAN via InstaPundit's Afghanistan correspondent, Boston University Professor John Robert Kelly:

BEER AND LOAFING IN AFGHANISTAN

It's a lonely and frustrating life for the western NGO and UN grief relief workers in Afghanistan. There are those hefty paychecks, often amounting to thousands of dollars, tax-free-- a week, but no place to spend it. After all, how many carpets and antique swords can one collect? Then there's that pesky problem of the desultory hours surfing the net in air conditioned estates converted to office space, but nowhere else to travel, except back to the villa in new, chauffeured Landcruisers for an evening of the same old faces, same old conversations. Numerous fearful directives and warnings keep these NGO workers from hitting the street and meeting and mingling with the Afghan population. When these warnings are lifted, few wish to wander from their guarded compound. There's a very valid awareness that the NGO permanent party isn't well liked by the Kabulis. An elderly Hazara rug merchant whose business has been halved by the timidity of NGO shoppers snorts derisively in perfect English, "Their feet never touch the ground in Kabul." And he's right. In a typical week, one sees just a few handfuls of westerners, mostly ISAF troops on holiday, even in the safest zones of the tourist traps and souvenir shops on Chicken Street, Kabul's answer to Rodeo Drive.

Many of the professional compassion corps are feeling restless and bored; they??ve already been staff in Kosovo, East Timor and Afghanistan, and nowadays believe they belong in Iraq, that's where the real money is. In the status conscious pecking order of NGO hierarchies, Afghanistan is passe. Only the palpable danger of Iraq keeps down the flurry of resumes from Kabul to Baghdad. It's the rare NGO worker who applies for work before the shooting is over and the maximum salaries are fixed. The money has been spent in Afghanistan, the bank is closed. The UN has larded tens of millions of dollars on an enormous fleet of brand new top-of-the-line Toyota Landcruisers, many times that on inflated salaries, mansions and the luxurious perks of occupying pashas. The needy locals are not amused. The American citizens who've liberally financed this largesse would be appalled at the waste.

It's not all monotonous or pointless in Kabul; at one French NGO housed in a stunning antique-laden chalet, I've devoured a seven-course meal prepared by a 4 star chef. Then there's always the sumptuous UN House, where one can take a dip, mingle poolside among scandalous bikinis and dowse dehydration with inspired cocktails fashioned by our languid Euro masters. Unfortunately, since "American UN employee" is an oxymoron, our one attempt to storm the formidable barricades is a spectacular failure. We're rudely turned away, despite flashing $20 bills to the Afghan UN security. My companion, a fierce Pushtoon-American licensed to pack a very visible Glock 19, glances back at the sunbathers as we're escorted out: "We've paid for all this with our taxes, you bastards!" One of the Pushto guard's shrugs his shoulders sympathetically, muttering an apology that suggests "someday this will all be ours again." For all the heroic American efforts in Afghanistan, truly and deeply appreciated by the indigenous population, we're still treated as unwanted nuisances by the predominantly European NGO residents.

For us hoi polloi, there was always the Irish Pub that opened on Saint Paddy's day to such fanfare in the western press, and with far greater gratitude in Kabul, but is now shuttered, a victim of its own success.

Sean McQuade's commercial instinct was impeccable: the creation of a stimulating oasis for thirsty westerners in one of the driest and most oppressively conservative cities in the Islamic world. The demand was high, a bit too high, according to some Afghans. In a city where getting stoned isn't an amusing colloquialism for intoxication but a literal description for the Taliban sport of getting smashed at the soccer stadium, Sean's otherwise laudable enterprise had a few defects in the business model, the most notable was that his public house had a mullah next door. McQuade had hoped for a lower profile for his tavern, but the spirited swarms of tipsy patrons pouring into their NGO SUVs in the late hours scandalized the neighborhood and not even the owner's gracious offer of baksheesh to rebuild local roads and schools could keep the speakeasy alive.

All is not lost for parched westerners in search of a public lager with good company, however, since other more discreet taps have opened throughout the city. At the Mustafa Hotel, long the favorite haven of adventuresome tourists and savvy international journalists, where last summer we diluted toxic contraband Tajik vodka (at $50 a liter) with Fanta, one can not only legally quaff a draught, but also surf the net or file a story at the same time...and not a mullah for a surf the net or file a story at the same time...and not a mullah for a hundred meters.
instapundit.com



To: Dayuhan who wrote (109019)7/31/2003 10:22:27 AM
From: Dennis O'Bell  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
Many upper middle class Filipinos raise their children to speak English as their first language. Same in India. A lot of them speak better English than a lot of American kids their age.

The key to near native level fluency is serious exposure to the second language before puberty, as well as a family environment that values learning.

Then there are numerous examples of people who have learned English much later than puberty (such as Andy Grove), well I guess that English not being his maternal language sure kept him out of the highest levels of the tech industry - not.



To: Dayuhan who wrote (109019)7/31/2003 3:06:29 PM
From: frankw1900  Respond to of 281500
 
Learning the power languages, whatever they are, is important and highly political and bad choices lead to disastrous results for societies and individuals.

For example, before the Tamil secessionist war in Sri Lanka the Sinhalese majority arranged education such that the Sinhalese were educated in Sinhala and English and the Tamils in Sinhala and Tamil.

This created naturally huge concern among Tamils for the futures of their children and great anger. The language of higher education, government and large business in all ex-British colonies is English and depriving a significant group from acquiring English is to attempt creation of a permanent under-class, and in the modern world an incitement to civil war, such as they have in Sri Lanka. Without this linguistic discrimination against Tamil children it's likely the marxists would have got nowhere in promoting the separatist war.

Acquisition of English is vitally important also because an ex-British colony is now the world's only super power. As China and possibly Russia become super powers, go ahead people and countries will be learning English, Mandarin, and possibly Russian, as normal activity (as my smart nephew has done).

Some British at height of their empire did not see the need for learning other languages - they were isolated by geography and power much as the US is - but many of those abroad in the empire did learn the colonials' language from necessity and interest, just as I'm sure US folk are doing in Iraq right now. Probably even more Iraqis are making great effort to learn English right now.

There is a saw off spot that's quick and dirty for adults but it does facilitate communication: Passive understanding of a language comes much faster than speaking it. Therefore if we each learn the other's language but speak our own to the other, we can get things understood and done more easily.