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Politics : Israel to U.S. : Now Deal with Syria and Iran -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Elmer Flugum who wrote (1367)	8/7/2003 3:12:28 PM
From: rrufff	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 22250

Of course, Israelis should just depart, forget about negotiations, just give in because of your theories. Tough to negotiate with this crowd don't you think? Muhammad ordered Muslims to kill Jews? Palestinian academic says tradition makes it religious obligation July 15, 2003 The killing of Jews is a mandatory religious obligation established by Islam's founder Muhammad, according to a Muslim academic who spoke on Palestinian Authority television. "Muhammad said in his Hadith: "The Hour [Day of Resurrection] will not arrive until you fight the Jews, [until a Jew will hide behind a rock or tree] and the rock and the tree will say: 'Oh Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!'" said Hassan Khader, founder of the Al Quds Encyclopedia. Khader spoke during a lecture, broadcast Sunday, on what he describes as the war of the Jews against Palestinian "trees." The program was monitored by Palestinian Media Watch, or PMW, an Israel-based group. PMW director Itamar Marcus says Khader's statement was one of many instances in recent years of Palestinian religious leaders teaching publicly that this Hadith – part of Islamic traditions attributed to Muhammad – is a current obligation of Islam. Marcus says these teachings challenge the common belief that the premise for negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians is over borders. "Palestinian religious and academic leaders publicly teach that the Israel-Palestinian conflict is part of Islam's irreconcilable religious war against the Jews," he says. "To justify this view," he adds, "Palestinians repeatedly cite Islamic sources to demand as religious doctrine, that Jews be hated, even demanding the killing of Jews as the will of Allah." Marcus says "the continued expression of this PA worldview is most ominous." "For by depicting redemption as dependent on Muslims' murder of Jews, the murder of Jews is being presented as mandatory religious obligation," he says. worldnetdaily.com

To: Elmer Flugum who wrote (1367)	8/7/2003 3:13:57 PM
From: rrufff	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 22250

Apparently it isn't just Jews that are hated but Christian converts as well. But I'll defer to your superior knowledge. worthynews.com Muslim Convert Butchered in the Holy Land By Michael Ireland Chief Correspondent, ASSIST News Service ISRAEL (ANS) -- The body of a Muslim convert to Christianity who went missing in mid-July, has been returned to his family, slaughtered and cut into four pieces by Islamic extremists, according to a report from the Barnabas Fund which monitored the incident. The man left his friends and family almost two weeks ago heading into a mountainous region of the Palestinian Authority area. He took Christian materials including cassettes, videos and Bibles with him. After approximately ten days, during which his friends and family received no word from him, his body was returned to them. He had been brutally killed and his body carved into four pieces as a warning to other converts. He leaves behind a wife and two small children. The names and further details of those involved are being withheld by Barnabas Fund for their own safety. Local Christians in this part of the Holy Land have been involved in supporting converts from a Muslim background who suffer persecution from Islamic extremists in the Palestinian Authority areas. Some of them have also been the target of attacks. Last year one such Christian received a phone call telling him that a Muslim convert was in a serious condition in hospital; in response he immediately set off in his car. On the way his vehicle was deliberately driven off the road by another car. The phone call later proved to be a hoax designed to lead him into trap. In another attempt on his life this same Christian was hospitalized. Local Christians working to support converts from Islam report that Islamic militants in the Palestinian Authority area deliberately target converts. Hamas in particular reportedly receives funding from Iran specifically for this purpose. According to shari’a (Islamic law) any Muslim male who leaves Islam (apostasies) faces the death penalty.

To: Elmer Flugum who wrote (1367)	8/7/2003 4:38:24 PM
From: Emile Vidrine	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 22250

An excellent post len! Definitely one of your best---and you have many. Thanks.

To: Elmer Flugum who wrote (1367)	8/7/2003 11:39:50 PM
From: hal jordan	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 22250

Len - >>I agree that many of the accusations are bogus and as stated indicate hatred for Jews, religious or secular (non-Jewish Jews).<< That is a positive acknowledgement, something that has been sorely lacking here. >>However, to state statistics that Jews have a strong presence in media, entertainment, publishing, and finance, is not hateful, per se.Nor is it a crime to be in those positions.<< The way Vidrine and others paint those statistics and infer nefarious doings and dark conspiracies against non-Jews because of those positions is pure anti-semitism. I'm glad you said it is not a crime to be in those positions. Vidrine, apparently from his postings, believes it is a crime for a Jew to be in those positions. >>It is only when those positions are used to finance settlements (shtetlments), buy weaponry, steal American military secrets, establish non-profit organizations and charities(tax-deductible from US taxes), send that money to Isra'El, slant the news, create movies, television programs, literature, religious dialogue that is half-truthful, does it become problematic and should be questioned and revealed to the public.<< Most of the news I see is slanted towards the Palestinians as the victims. So if Jews are in charge of the media and have a bias towards Israel, it is not apparent from what I read. As far as movies and television programs, again, what are you seeing? I don't recall any movies lately being positive about Israel or Arabs, mostly superheroes seem to be in to me... >>FYI, Isra'El is the most dangerous place for a Jew to be.<< You do understand the historical reasons the country of Israel was created. What I'm not sure you can grasp is the absolute, overwhelming suffering of Holocaust survivors and the world opinion that something had to be done for these displaced people. I could tell you stories you would never believe could occur by humans, witnessed and experienced by eyes far too young for exposure. Without this background, it may be understandably difficult for you to appreciate what Israel means to these people and their children, and why it would never be given up. Hal