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Technology Stocks : Oracle Corporation (ORCL) -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: ge who wrote (18274)	8/12/2003 4:13:53 PM
From: Michael Olin	Respond to of 19079

I really didn't want to do much more than lurk about this whole Offshore/H1-B debate, but I can't let one statement go unchallenged: I am not suggesting that ORCL move their corporation off shore, but that when they are looking for computer professionals and can not find adequately trained candidates in the US, they should be able to find them where they can. And please don't tell me about all the computer "professionals” that are unemployed. They were car mechanics and checkout clerks before they graduated from DeVry and a host of other "universities" and they are car mechanics now, not unemployed computer professionals. I know of quite a few former Oracle employees who are more than adequately trained, have graduate degrees from real (no quotes) universities, and are now looking for work (not as auto mechanics). I also know people who are similarly educated and qualified, many of them ex-Oracle by their own choice, who are now looking for work or working for a fraction of their former salaries. We could debate endlessly about the causes of this situation, and frankly, I'm not interested. There are many reasons that computer jobs have gone overseas, some of them have to do with the desire to establish a global 24/7/365 presence (I've always had the most success with Oracle's tech support center in Australia). Most computer companies that move jobs overseas, however, are probably doing it because labor is significantly less expensive than in the US. To suggest that computer jobs are moving overseas because the talent does not exist domestically is simply wrong. You can argue all you like for or against US trade and labor policies. There are plenty of valid and invalid arguments on both sides. Just keep the red herrings out of the debate. We all know that the Offshore/H1-B situation has next to nothing to do with talent and almost everything to do with money. -Michael

To: ge who wrote (18274)	8/12/2003 4:21:42 PM
From: Lizzie Tudor	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 19079

And please don't tell me about all the omputer "professionals” that are unemployed. They were car mechanics and checkout clerks before they graduated from DeVry your bias and lack of knowledge about software engineers at least in Silicon Valley is truly amazing. But anyway, I am all for offshoring and in fact I work with some companies that engage in the practice. But dumping below market labor on silicon valley in the form of these L1 visas is unacceptable to me and apparently to congress too. The reason the visas were created was not to drop US wages to indian levels, the visas were started to deal with a shortage we had in skills here at the time. The shortage no longer exists, so visas are gone, good riddance. Again, companies are quite capable of offshoring any task they want - if the offshore team is good there should be no need to come here for "knowledge transfer". Just the fact that companies like Oracle feel the need to bring people here from india for "training" invalidates the "no adequately trained candidates" byline right there.