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Politics : Sharks in the Septic Tank -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Neocon who wrote (74400)	9/11/2003 9:12:49 AM
From: Lane3	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

On the contrary, it is his business if the client is turned on. Perhaps we're having a terminology problem. I had in mind that the client quietly found the massage pleasing in a way that had sexual overtones. Which is not the same thing as, er, conspicuously turned on as in ejaculating all over the massage table. The latter, of course, would be the business of the therapist. The former, I think, is not. The latter is an unacceptable sexual behavior issue. I already stipulated behavior. Do you think that, say, a woman lying there quietly fantasizing about knights in shining armor as she is being massaged is any of the therapist's business. Or is she only allowed to think about what she's going to fix for dinner? And is it reasonable for him to turn her away on the chance that she might think about something other than dinner menus?

To: Neocon who wrote (74400)	9/11/2003 12:21:52 PM
From: E	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 82486

I haven't read all the posts on this subject. But... Some thoughts on what I have read, though. A question is, has the masseur flirted in any way, or indicated a sexual interest in the prospective client? That would make the situation very different from one in which the masseur just happened to be gay. Males get massages from masseuses all the time. (I'm sure that's been pointed out.) Here's an incident that occurred on Queer Eye. I'm talking only about this incident, not about other aspects of the program, including sexual, or mock-sexual, behavior on the part of the gays toward the straight guys. (I suspect that's been talked about already here, anyway.) One of the straight guys was going to get a suntan treatment (I think it was). His gay escort was, too. So there was a moment when they were both in their underwear. Nothing sexual was going on, but the straight guy was very rattled, embarrassed, and expressed it (cutely). He said, "This is so gay!" The straight guy then said, "I don't understand that. I mean, it's gay over here (he indicated his side of an imaginary wall), but why is it gay over there?") Another anecdote: When I lived overseas, the American Embassy nurse was a lesbian who had recently been outed. When I came due for a physical, including the usual pelvic/pap etc, she said, "If you feel uncomfortable having me do it, I will send you to someone else for your pelvic examination." It seemed that some women had asked to be sent elsewhere. Which is so crazy. Those same women went to male doctors all the time. I'm not saying that people shouldn't have the right to reject a massage or physical by anyone they want for any reason at all. But I'm free to, and do, draw certain conclusions about the rejectors based on some choices they might make. Like that maybe they're dumb as rocks or have weird phobias or are afraid they'll get excited and find out something they don't want to know about themselves. Or some darn thing.