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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Brumar89 who wrote (116908)	10/15/2003 12:17:35 PM
From: Jacob Snyder	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

My point was, the history of Western military intervention in Muslim nations, and violating their sovereignty in other ways (the "unequal" treaties), started long before 2001, or 1973. I agree with you, if you say that Ottoman imperialism was as bad or worse as other imperialisms. They did their share of pogroms and ethnic cleansing. Arabs have forgotten none of this history, what they suffered at the hands of Turks and Crusaders. They will still cite, in detail, 7th or 12 Century history, to justify today's actions. re: <But I wonder if the European powers also wanted treaties insuring their nationals were governed by their own courts and laws because of a lack of justice in Ottoman law and courts.> Here's a thought experiment. Let's say that, in 1850, the Ottomans were the world's strongest empire, instead of the weakest. Their traders and missionaries went all over the world. Islam outlaws slavery, so the Ottomans in the U.S. told blacks that slavery was against God's law. Whites responded by lynching some Ottoman missionaries in Virginia. The Sultan sent an armada, in a "display of force". Ottoman troops occupied Norfolk and Savannah, did some burning and killing, to punish the Christian savages for their violence against the civilized Muslims. The Ottoman armada didn't leave, until the U.S. Congress approved a treaty allowing Ottomans on U.S. soil to be exempt from U.S. laws (and exempt from U.S. taxes as well). The U.S. had trouble paying back a previous loan from the Ottomans, so the Turks took over U.S. customs revenue, placing their agents in all our ports, and diverted all the customs revenue to Istanbul. When American mobs protested this, Turkish warships came back, and this time they stayed. A few years later, the Turks declared the Mississippi Valley to be a "Ottoman sphere of influence", and annexed New Orleans, renaming it New Istanbul.