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Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: PartyTime who wrote (522570)	1/11/2004 6:21:15 PM
From: Srexley	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 769670

"I didn't know that Afghanistan was a home base for Saddam" It's not. What are you talking about? "Iraq was a secular, non-religious kind of government, that women amounted to 60 percent of those who attended university and that there was a real estate and a stock market?" Sounds like you are fan of Saddam. Do you approve of dictators who have the some good aspects about their society, yet oppress and kill those they do not agree with? "Now the country is back to growing opium" Sounds like you prefer the Taliban too. I suppose you are in the know, and that there was no opium under the Taliban. A country that protects and allows a terrorist group to plan attacks against the U.S. and the free world while killing people for bieng gay and COMPLETELY oppressing women is better to you, but THAT IS PRECISELY the difference between me and you. "Thank you, Mr. Bush--your war sure helped make our children safer" He sure has. Your children (if there is a woman desparate enough to have some with you) will live in a world MUCH safer than it was on 9-10-01. I am very glad (and your children will be too) that your suggested courses of action (or nonaction) listed above to leave Afghanistan and Iraq as they were are not being followed. You are the 1st I have seen with these suggestions. "I don't understand what you're getting at here" This does not surprise me. It seems you are the only one who does not (although many on your side disagree with my points). Seems like Party time spends too much time partying and not enough time thinking. "There are (terrorist camps in Iraq)?" Excuse me. I meant there WERE. Not anymore. "You mean it's okay for Israel to break them, but not Iraq?" Looks like there is another anti-Semite on the board. You should get more specific with your charges. And try to use some logic that is better than "these guys are bad, but since some others are bad that is ok too". My guess is that you use this logic to support your "party time". If you are curious as to my Israeli position I will say that they were attacked a number of times by people (counties) with the intent to ELIMINATE Israel. Once you do that, you have tossed out any moral authority. But there are plenty who hate Jews just as there are plenty that hate the U.S. I suggest you open your mind a bit and learn to love democratic and free societies and their people. "You mean help them (Iraqis) like we did by keeping sanctions imposed?" No, I mean help them like we are currently doing by liberating them. Something you do not care about. "You mean help them by raining bombs upon them?" No, I mean help them like we are currently doing by liberating them. Something you do not care about. "You mean help them by making sure their oil is nice and in control?" No, I mean help them like we are currently doing by liberating them. Something you do not care about. "Are you really a "happy Iraqi" advocate?" I am an advocate of the United States of America and all freedom loving people. That the Iraqis will be helped is a great benefit to removing Iraq. But as your post obviouls implies, you do not care about that. "Mostly, this war covers the illegitimacy of how Bush got elected" This is another demo lie that is particularly irritating because it cannot be backed up. Nobody on this thread (or anybody else I have ever asked) could state why Gore deserved hand recounts after the mandatory machine recount(by FL state law) that Bush won. Can you? I know the answer is no, but feel free to give it a whirl if you dare. "The best way to help Israel is for America to have a better and stronger, certainly more appreciative image in the eyes of the Arab world" And we are giving them that. Even though you supported the Taliban, Al Quida and Saddam does not mean the rest of the Arab world does. Many do hate us, as they are taught from a very early age to do so. But when peole are free and prosperous they generally like it better than being oppressed. It is clear you prefer them to be oppressed, but somehow want them to like us anyway. But that is a pipe dream. "I didn't realize, presuming I'm one of them, that that was my position." Re-read your own post. Seeing as you are advocating letting Afghanistan and Iraq stay as they were it seems kind of obvious. "Well, I'm very serious about the scenario of radical and fundamentalist Muslims taking the writing of Ann Coulter and saying, "See? See what the Americans really want!" " Like many demos, you are into censorship. Your free not to like Coulter, but suggesting she not be allowed to express her opinions is UN-AMERICAN. She gets peeved at guys like you who blame us and work against us. Not all of you are traitors, but you are "usefull idiots" at the least. "What we've succeeded in doing is making America a great place for some people--not all people!" Since it is not possible (imo) to MAKE THINGS GREAT for people, your point is worthless. If you want to live a decent life and are willing to work at it, I think America is tops. What country do you think is better? Why do you think the government should make things great for all the people? I think the gov't should provide the opportunity to succeed and protect the people. Seems like you think they should provide the greatness and I think gov't should provide the opportunity to achieve greatness. Different views to be sure, but I will argue to keep it the way are framers intended. "since I've got a bit of time on my hands today" Probably better off to party some more, dude.

To: PartyTime who wrote (522570)	1/11/2004 8:12:16 PM
From: stockman_scott	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 769670

Discouraged Job-Seekers Mask True Jobless Rate reuters.com Sun January 11, 2004 10:26 AM ET By Andrea Hopkins WASHINGTON (Reuters) - For President Bush and his economic team, Friday's news that the U.S. jobless rate fell to its lowest level in more than a year must have looked heartening -- at first. But a closer look at the Labor Department report told a far bleaker story, with 433,000 Americans categorized as "discouraged workers" -- those who have given up looking for a job because they have abandoned hope of finding one. In December alone, Labor statisticians dropped 309,000 Americans from the labor force, no longer counting them as unemployed because they have stopped looking for work. That cut the participation rate to just 66 percent, a level not plumbed since recession-plagued 1991. Economists believe the drop in the labor force masks a much higher jobless rate -- perhaps as high as 9 percent, according to Anthony Chan, chief economist at Banc One Investment Advisors in Columbus, Ohio. "The decline in the unemployment rate is the most misleading aspect of this employment report," said Chan. "It's a sham because of how we got there -- the labor force dropped precisely because more people became discouraged." Usually, out-of-work Americans rejoin the job hunt as the economy strengthens, believing growth will spur hiring. But despite more than two years of expansion since the end of the 2001 recession, America remains locked in a jobless recovery and the labor force is falling, not rising. NOT BUYING THE HYPE Wells Fargo chief economist Sung Won Sohn said all the talk lately about the booming economy and rising stock market did little to persuade employers or job-seekers that their prospects were picking up as 2003 drew to a close. "Despite all the hoopla, neither businesses nor potential employees have confidence in the economy. They're not believing all the stories about a strong and healthy economy given by the economists and the government," Sohn said. "Economic growth is great, but the job market is lousy." While the economy raced ahead at an annual rate of 8.2 percent in the third quarter of 2003 on the back of Bush's summer tax cuts and a booming housing market, job growth remains tepid. Since July, 278,000 nonfarm jobs have been created -- paling in comparison to the 2.3 million lost since Bush took office. Sohn said many of the discouraged workers are likely refugees from the factory sector, where 2.8 million jobs have been cut in 41 straight months since the industry's last peak in July 2000. With many jobs gone forever to cheap-labor countries like China or India, workers have little hope of finding work that can compare with the $20-an-hour jobs they lost, Sohn said. "People who lost jobs in manufacturing, especially some of the older workers, they look at the landscape and say, 'why should I waste my time?' And they simply drop out of the labor force," Sohn said.