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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jamey who wrote (36396)	1/14/2004 2:03:05 AM
From: Berry Picker	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 39621

I think it is up to each person to explain what they personally believe because someone can be a part of a church and yet differ radically on some particular doctrine. If someone says they belong to a certain denomination then they get pigeon holed as believing something they may not. Just my opinion. It seems to me the biggest problem is that people tend to treat this forum as a chance at public debate - it then degenerates because they are more interesting in showing themselves as winning than actually discussing truth - it is rare for someone to admit that they may in fact have been wrong - even about a single point never mind about their entire position. Pride is a powerful blinder. Brian

To: Jamey who wrote (36396)	1/14/2004 2:15:57 AM
From: Berry Picker	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

James - have you heard anything about this bible that Alan was recommending the other night. I looked at it a little - apparently translated in 1930 or so??? It perked my interest to be honest. Alan brought up a good point - and I have recognized this for a while that Strong's was pretty much the status quo when it came to belief and catered to what the KJV boys believed for instance: 165 aiwn aion ahee-ohn’ from the same as 104; TDNT-1:197,31; n m AV-ever 71, world 38, never + 3364 + 1519 + 3588 6, evermore 4, age 2, eternal 2, misc 5; 128 1) for ever, an unbroken age, perpetuity of time, eternity 2) the worlds, universe 3) period of time, age The word never means 'worlds or universe' in Greek. It is totally restricted to time. He gave it the meaning because that is how the KJV boys translated it. They wanted the verses to say -"end of the world" so they changed it then Strong's added those meanings in his works. From error to error. Aion is the word that we get eons from meaning a long time but in greek simply meaning time. World is rightly translated from Kosmos not Aion: 2889 kosmov kosmos kos’-mos probably from the base of 2865; TDNT-3:868,459; n m AV-world 186, adorning 1; 187 1) an apt and harmonious arrangement or constitution, order, government 2) ornament, decoration, adornment, i.e. the arrangement of the stars, ‘the heavenly hosts’, as the ornament of the heavens. #1Pe 3:3 3) the world, the universe 4) the circle of the earth, the earth 5) the inhabitants of the earth, men, the human family 6) the ungodly multitude; the whole mass of men alienated from God, and therefore hostile to the cause of Christ 7) world affairs, the aggregate of things earthly 7a) the whole circle of earthly goods, endowments riches, advantages, pleasures, etc, which although hollow and frail and fleeting, stir desire, seduce from God and are obstacles to the cause of Christ 8) any aggregate or general collection of particulars of any sort 8a) the Gentiles as contrasted to the Jews (#Ro 11:12 etc) 8b) of believers only, #John 1:29; 3:16; 3:17; 6:33; 12:47 #1Co 4:9; 2Co 5:19 Kosmos from which we get our word Cosmos never means time while Aion never means world but always an age or time Alan is quite right I cannot argue that Strong's was not exactly faithful in his exposition of Greek meanings. That being said - he may also be right about that translation as being a good tool. Have you ever heard of it before? Do you know anything about it - good or bad?? Brian

To: Jamey who wrote (36396)	1/14/2004 6:08:23 AM
From: 2MAR$	Respond to of 39621

I hope that Stan doesn't mind, and he can correct me, but I believe he is a converted Christian Jew You know, in reality Santiago , you really are more of an atheist , than a believer . Very little that is christian about you my friend....if you think you are a christian , be a little less smug in your outlook...I know it is hard , but truth often is for one so buried in prejudice. Whether anyone is this or is that , if their heart is pure what does it matter ? By their deeds you shall know them...but you wouldn't know them , though history is filled with examples of the great souls that have blessed and filled life from all corners of the world. "Believers " such as yourself , like the Orangutan are headed for extinction...fast . but do not fret , all good souls go to heaven, even orangutan souls...hehe even the Jewish , Islamic , Buddhist , Hindu , ones you may not like. ;-)