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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Bilow who wrote (126273)3/15/2004 11:22:20 PM
From: NightOwl  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
Hibackatya CB!

I see us as a very strong nation with extremely strong civil institutions, institutions that have, over the decades, become stronger. For example, I don't see us putting Moslems into "internment camps", like we did the Japanese-Americans.

I suspect this is just your optimism confusing "strength" with "moments of inertia." It's a common mistake of non-Owlers. <vbg>

This is not true. Americans are well loved throughout the world, at least partly because we have immigrants from all over the world living here. What's not loved is our government, and in particular, the military actions of our government. Our tourists and individuals are not just tolerated, but welcomed all over the world, providing they keep with local customs (just like visitors from all over the world are welcomed here, provided they follow our customs).

Well... I will grant you, American "stuff" is well loved throughout the world. The fact that we have immigrants only proves that many people know they will get more "stuff" if they go to work in the "stuff" store. Similarly the world welcomes our tourrorists in the knowledge that they come bearing "stuff." And if by "keeping with local customs" you mean, leaving in three days or less, without most of the "stuff" you came in with, then I would have to admit grudging agreement.<g>

Your version of the Arab complaint against us is useful only for people who want to define the Arabs as our enemy no matter what our foreign policy is, and therefore our foreign policy must be one of coercion against them. There is an inherent contradiction in this foreign policy. It is treating the Arabs as if they are animals incapable of using reason to guide their actions, while simultaneously believing that one can use force to bring them to reason, LOL.

"Arab complaint?" This ain't no stinking "Arab complaint!" It's a universal complaint! Nobody likes the Top Dog CB. ...Not even the subordinates in his own pack. Heck you can't even keep a President for two terms anymore. ...'Less he can pass the Joey Buttafuoco Common Dogman Test anyway. ...Arab complaint indeed... And as far as your anti coercion, anti animal attitudes are concerned, I can only say that I am shocked and disheartened. Yes I expect Arabs to act like reasoning animals. What would you have me believe they'll act like ...reasoning rocks?? <Hoo><Hoo>

Suffice to say if you want to remain Top Dog and have a moral aversion to coercion, then by all means try bribery/deceit. But please. Give them YOUR "stuff" not mine because I just don't have much left. Anyway when you run out of "stuff" and decide it "reasonable" to resort to your only other foreign policy option - nasty coercion - please let me know who you intend to use it on Israel, Europe, China, Arabia? I would certainly not want to be Tourrorizing in the wrong place when you finally "Whig" out. <vbg>

But this is not my version CB. ...The Deadly Dichotomy made me do it. You will find inherent contradiction in all foreign policy and every thing else you touch.

No one is targeting us because we're Americans. They're targeting us because we target them.

Hey get over it. Until and unless you find a way to give up the Crown, step down from the Throne, give up the Numero Uno place at the carcass, and the "Leadership of The Free World" that goes with it, THEY will be coming after you.

The evidence that Iraq was not a threat, and that they would be impossible to occupy was so deep and pervasive that our long time allies, France and Germany, as well as every neighboring nation (who would be the ones to know best) refused to give us any support, other than Kuwait, who let us use their territory but didn't lift a finger to help with the occupation. Bush ignored the weight of the evidence and went with a version of reality that ignored everything other than what he wanted to believe. If you can't figure out that Bush was stupid, then you should consider voting for Kerry because Kerry might be "luckier".

I will grant you, this Bush guy is not very good at coercion or bribery /deceit; but I figure he can learn. ...After all he's a reasoning animal too.

Personally if it were up to me I might consider making OBL the next God Emperor. He's already schooled in being chased and bombed. Who knows it might be such a shock to the Deadly Dichotomy that it finally sets us free to formulate the utopian world wide dictatorship of love and harmony that all our animal reasoning wants so badly. <Hoo><Hoo>

Pakistan has about 6x more people than Iraq, and would require an occupying force around 6x larger. Of course our occupation in Iraq has nowhere near enough troops, so Pakistan is far beyond our capability.

Of course, I blame this "occupation" fetish on the Roosevelt/Stalin WWIIers. Lordy! If I was selling jars of Roosevelt pee-pee I could make a billion dollars in 2 weeks. "Occupation" falls under the bribery/deceit branch of foreign policy and as such it is nearly always counterproductive. I swear, you'd think the world was some kind of antique store with a "you break it you bought it" policy.

What is needed for any competent Top Dog today is the certainty of the old "smash, grab and get" war policy of Sherman/Grant. Let the mess fester and ferment. If it produces a worthy blend keep it. If not "smash, grab, and get" again and again until they get it right. Keep the Europeans busy snarfing up what's left in the ME and let China crucify the Koreans. ...Why the Rwandans can make this work and we can't is just beyond me. ...You'd think we were unreasoning animals or something.

Gotta hand it to you though CB. ...You are one slick customer.

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