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Politics : Don't Blame Me, I Voted For Kerry -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: mph who wrote (19116)	4/29/2004 12:38:55 PM
From: Orcastraiter	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 81568

Some on the left actually appear to be pulling for ignominious defeat. It sure seems that way anyway. Kerry has called for a troop increase. He has also called for more internationalization. He has stated that losing in Iraq is not an option. You must be talking about someone else on the left. Orca

To: mph who wrote (19116)	4/29/2004 12:58:01 PM
From: Orcastraiter	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 81568

The propaganda techniques are the same, though. The enemy is trying to win here in our streets. Because it is an election year, there's a good chance of success with that technique. Partisanship is rampant. Some on the left actually appear to be pulling for ignominious defeat. It sure seems that way anyway. The protests against the Vietnam war did not lose the war. Blaming the protestors for a war that was firstly ramped up on a staged lie, had no clear objective and was not being fought with overwhelming force is a right wing lie. The war was lost because it was not executed with conviction or purpose. It was a failed policy that was consuming thousands of lives every week. Even today you cannot justify the war in Vietnam. The justification for the war in Iraq has run it's course. It's long since past the time to internationalize the war and were on our way to hand power back to the Iraqi people. This is the right course of action to take. Bush's policies in Iraq have failed because he left the Iraqi people out of his calculations. With no jobs and high unemployment the Iraqi people have become restless. The majority of people see the Americans as occupiers and not liberators. The situation in Iraq is dynamic. And things on the ground are changing rapidly...mostly due to reaction to bad American policy. Bush screwed up by not involving the Iraqi people. By not providing immediate full employment and resources to the people. By not retaining the army and the police. He ignored his own State Department's plans for reconstruction and he ignored the advice of Arab neighbors. Bush has failed to execute in Iraq. A war that very likely could have been completely avoided, as Powell suggested to the president. But you break it you own it...and that includes the dreams and aspirations of the Iraqi people...which have been ignored. Orca

To: mph who wrote (19116)	4/29/2004 1:10:01 PM
From: bentway	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 81568

In Vietnam, LBJ is on record saying "I'll be goddamned if I'm going to be the first President to lose a war." He then proceeded to make sure thousands of more Americans and millions of Vietnamese died for his hubris, before refusing to run again and begging forgiveness. Nixon came in with a "secret plan" to end the war, which included carpet bombing, invading Cambodia, and making sure he ran up the total to 58,000 before bugging out. With Bush and Kerry, seems like more of the same. How is Iraq like Vietnam? The people don't want us there. They didn't attack us, ever. The "insurgents" look just like the citizens. And like Vietnam, if we left, the main result would be less people dying. Like the Vietnamese, the Iraqis might just be able to cook up a government on their own that wouldn't threaten us.