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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Neocon who wrote (131769)	5/7/2004 5:15:16 PM
From: Bilow	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Hi Neocon; Re: "The main idea is that time is running out, and there is no other means available except a beating to locate and neutralize the device, which is of sufficient magnitude to take out a large number of shoppers." Why don't you quit beating around the bush and admit it. You are in favor of staging homosexual photographs of Iraqi prisoners, if it would advance our cause. In other words, for you, the ends fully justifies whatever means are required to obtain it. It reminds me of the quehubo comment "we must win this war". -- Carl

To: Neocon who wrote (131769)	5/7/2004 7:40:09 PM
From: Jacob Snyder	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

<no other means available except a beating> 1. You've got a prison full of prisoners, and you have no idea which one has the crucial intel. Torture them all? 2. Maybe none of the prisoners you hold, has the intel. Torture them all, anyway, just in case? 3. Under torture, people will tell you whatever they think will stop the torture. So the intel is suspect. 4. in your cost/benefit analysis, you're leaving out other important consequences: the rage of the prisoners (and their families, and their friends, when they find out what happened) when the prisoners are released back into the community. The increased chance our own soldiers will get tortured, when the tables are turned. What you and Hawkmoon are posting back and forth to each other, is exactly what Saddam's torturer's told each other. You've gone far, far down the slippery slope into savagery.