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Politics : Should God be replaced? -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Solon who wrote (17446)	5/11/2004 9:38:33 AM
From: TigerPaw	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 28931

There was a show on PBS last nigh about the Dead Sea Scrolls. There was no mention of Jesus in the scrolls, but many passages in scrolls seemed to turn up in the new testament. John the Babtist was almost certainly an Essene (for whom ritual bathing was an important rite). Their messianic prophesys were quite differnt from later christianity. Their speculation was that Paul & followers took a Pharasee tradition of messianic predictions and added much of the poetry of the Essene tradition. No mention was made of Philo of Alexandrea, althought the writing of Josephus were confirmed by several scroll passages (the bulk of which were not religious documents). There was even a treasure map, but so far nobody has found a treasure. TP

To: Solon who wrote (17446)	5/11/2004 10:44:02 AM
From: Greg or e	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 28931

<<<<"Therefore (like the crocodile) we kill, kill, and kill to EAT, EAT, and EAT! Are we being EVIL? NO!!" "In the social creatures referred to as Homo sapiens there are certain behaviours which rationally lead to profit. These include social organization for mutual protection and emotional alliances for sexual and social power. And they include treating friends and associates with honesty and fair value. And they include a tolerance of differences which do not threaten the essential harmony and survival of the group.">>>> <><Of course if you are not a friend then all bets are off. There is nothing in those empty platitudes that would compel anyone to adhere to them since they are simply opinions.><> "You are not saying anything to the point of our discussion, and you know it. Implying that religious beliefs are not opinions is pure and simple nonsense." I did not say yours was an opinion and mine was not. I am saying that your opinion does not stand up to rational scrutiny so it is not logically compelling. I think it's you that has missed the point of the discussion. I have been saying that morals (actually ethics) are not universally possible without a transcendent basis. You assert that; "obviously...rational self interest compels such people.". Not only is that not obvious, but you have failed to show that it is even rationally coherent. "Where people are incapable of voluntarily treating others in a civilized manner, then they are subject to the opprobrium and the consequence of the collective social mores. You call these social mores that have been worked out by humanity over thousands of years of trial and error, and struggling civilization..."empty platitudes"." You keep conveniently forgetting that humans have always pointed to a transcendent basis for the the things we all know are right and wrong. You want to eliminate that transcendent basis but keep all the benefits. You can't have your cake and eat it too. Even if you hold your breath until you turn purple.