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Politics : Piffer Thread on Political Rantings and Ravings -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jorj X Mckie who wrote (13178)	5/13/2004 8:36:13 AM
From: Augustus Gloop	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 14610

<<Did the U.S. exploit those countries? yes.>> I guess if you include the fact that we engineered and built their oil facilities one might conclude that any "exploitation" was payback. What created the problem is when their goat f**king leaders decision not to spread the wealth.

To: Jorj X Mckie who wrote (13178)	5/13/2004 9:54:49 AM
From: MrLucky	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 14610

Jorj, Are you finding it difficult to "debate" with a "non-debater" yet? <g>

To: Jorj X Mckie who wrote (13178)	5/13/2004 5:15:33 PM
From: tejek	Respond to of 14610

<font color=brown>If you are attacking my opinions re. Nick Berg and Rumsfeld, you are welcome to do so. However, I have no intention of defending them to you or to anyone else. Since shock and awe, I believe Rumsfeld has not done his job well and should be fired. His failure to secure the peace in Iraq has caused the death of many American lives including Nick Berg's. That is my opinion and if you disagree that's your right.<font color=black> What I am sick of is the rest of the world claiming victim status, with the U.S. being the sole victimizer. The plight of the ME people is primarily the fault of the leaders and the people in those countries who refuse to look inward for the cause of their problems. Did the U.S. exploit those countries? yes. Did we do it at their invitation and make them very very rich in the process? yes. Did the leaders of those countries choose to better the quality of life for their people? no. Do they blame that on the U.S.? yes.A <font color=brown>There has been considerable horror in the world to the beheading. I posted the article below becauses it specifically discusses reactions in Iraq and other parts of the Arab world. Having said that, I don't understand your seeming surprise that some perceive us as the victimizers. Why does that come as a surprise to you? We invaded Iraq on our own perogative..........no one told us to do it nor did anyone give us permission. Good or bad, we violated the sovereignty of another nation. Why would you think that that would be greeted with great praise and joy? The rest of the world does not necessarily see us as the good guys you think they should.<font color=black> I got what you're alluding to.... obviously not. in the post that I was alluding to, you were showing why they were justified in hating us. Afterall, they claimed all of SA as a holy land and we infidels were over there defiling their holy land. <font color=brown>You know........you're starting to go into doublespeak mode.....common to some people on SI. I speak and understand English well. Post your point clearly and I will respond accordingly. <font color=black> ********************************************************** May 13, 2004. 01:00 AM Family reels from slaying ROSIE DIMANNO WEST WHITELAND, Pa.—Divided by politics, united by blood. The Berg family, in its grief, is a microcosm of this country. A peacenik father who opposed the war in Iraq; a son who believed in it and fully supported President George W. Bush. Nick Berg's nature — adventurer, citizen of the world, brilliant techno-freak, a small businessman with a big humanitarian heart — took him to Baghdad, in part to make money but mostly, it would appear, to help in the reconstruction of a benighted nation. He did so against the wishes of his family. And that family, later convinced their son was being held illegally by the United States military, subsequently sued the federal government. Officials yesterday denied this claim, insisting Berg had been detained by Iraqi police, although interviewed three times by the FBI while in custody. Secluded for most of the day in their home in West Chester, a small town 40 kilometres west of Philadelphia, the Bergs continue to maintain that the government is partly responsible for their son's death; that the 26-year-old private contractor would have been home safe by now if he hadn't missed his flight, if he hadn't been detained and kept incommunicado for 13 days, before finally being released on April 6. "The Iraqi police do not tell the FBI what to do, the FBI tells the Iraqi police what to do. Who do they think they're kidding?'' Berg's father Michael told the Associated Press. At some point after April 6, Nick Berg was taken captive by Islamic terrorists, apparently a cell of Al Qaeda. His headless body was found on Saturday near an overpass in Baghdad. The moment of his murder, was captured by cameras and posted on the Internet, a macabre video entitled "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American." That Web site is operated by a group named Muntada al-Ansar, and regularly carries statements issued by jihadist militants. Al-Zarqawi, a Jordanian, is believed to be a close associate of Osama bin Laden. In Baghdad yesterday, residents decried the murder as an offence to Islam, perpetrated by individuals who have appropriated the faith for their own execrable motives. Lebanon's Hezbollah guerrilla group also condemned it, saying in a statement the act had "done very great harm to Islam and Muslims by this group that claims affiliation to the religion of mercy, compassion and humane principles." It added: "The timing of this act ... serve(s) the American administration and occupation forces in Iraq and present excuses and pretexts for their inhumane practices against Iraqi detainees." In West Chester, the Bergs relayed their anger with the federal government through next-door neighbour and family spokesman Rev. Bruce Hauser. "I have to believe that the American government had him in their custody," Hauser told reporters, expressing the family's views. "The Bergs wanted the government to release him so he could come home. As parents, they're angry." A coalition spokesman in Baghdad reiterated yesterday that Berg had been picked up by Iraqi police who suspected irregularities in his travel documents. As a result of the detention, he missed a booked March 30 flight back to the U.S. The following day, FBI agents visited his family, wanting to know why Berg was in Iraq in the first place and to confirm his identity. thestar.com