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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Sarmad Y. Hermiz who wrote (135682)	6/4/2004 8:59:33 PM
From: Ish	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

((>> But I'm also opposed to military forces seeking to use children as human shields, or locating their forces in civilian areas as well.. So you are opposed to Isaraeli soldiers riding on buses that school children use. That's very good of you.)) Protecting and using them as shields are all togther different.

To: Sarmad Y. Hermiz who wrote (135682)	6/4/2004 10:53:39 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

So you are opposed to Isaraeli soldiers riding on buses that school children use. That's very good of you. The Palestinian gunners use children as human shields when firing and on the front lines, during ambushes. So for the Israelis to be equivalent, they would have to perch little children on their tanks during maneuvers. But wait, would the sight of an Israeli child slow Hamas or Fatah down? It certainly hasn't so far. It never did when they blew up bus stops or pizzarias. Have you noticed that in all previous wars, it was thought necessary to get some of your enemies' women and children to have an effective hostage situation? In this war, you can use your own ... if you are a Palestinian. Isn't that convenient? Just one more difference between the sides.

To: Sarmad Y. Hermiz who wrote (135682)	6/5/2004 2:09:24 AM
From: Hawkmoon	Respond to of 281500

So you are opposed to Isaraeli soldiers riding on buses that school children use. That's very good of you. Are they on, or off duty? Are they carrying their rifles when not on duty, and traveling in the occupied territories? If so, then yes, I'm opposed. Are they in Israel, off duty, carrying rifles within the confines of their own borders? I don't like it, but that's their country. Are they in the occupied territories and acting as security forces on duty protecting that bus? Then no, I'm not opposed. Please define which scenario you're referring to.. And then tell me if police officers should be permitted to carry their sidearmes on public transportation? For many of those soldiers are doing double duty as security and police. And many of those soldiers carrying arms on buses are part of the border guard. IOW, they are police with arrest authority. But either way, attacking buses with children, when the soldiers are NOT engaging the Palestinians in combat, or attempting to use those children as shields so they can conduct combat operations, if criminal. Btw, do you think that the Israelis should be able to target Palestinian buses, or cars that are carrying armed men mixed with children? So you are also opposed to US occupation security contractors doing whatever mission they do in Iraq. I think that puts you on a collision course with official US policy. They are contractors. They are not under UCMJ and they work for various other corporations for the purpose of providing security related tasks. They are NOT combatants, per se, because they are not engaged in actively seeking out, or attacking, resistance forces. And they know that if they are killed or captured, they are pretty much "on their own" and likely to face torture or death. So you are also opposed to the use of hospitals for the care of wounded soldiers. Gee don't you think that is a bit extreme. How about water trucks ? Someone can claim those are dual use ? No? Wounded soldiers, not involved in using the hospital for combat operations? Heck no.. That's what hospitals are for.. And many Palestinians, when captured, have been cared for in Israeli hospitals. But using a mosque or hospital for the purpose of cacheing arms and ammunition, or to use it as a base for combat operations? Verboten!! About as guilt as any occupation resistance movement. Then why aren't you criticizing them? Is this the kind of government you want to see established in Palestine? One full of corruption, with an armed force of "soldiers" who have little regard to human rights, let alone the Geneva convention? I propose that both Palestinian and Israelis be put under the jurisdiction of the International Criminal Court. There's no need for an international criminal court if the governments involved enforce their own laws regarding violations of the Rules of Engagement, as well as war crimes. So considering that the Palestinians have no system in place for trying their war criminals, I would say that the ICC might be a good idea for them.. Hawk