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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: jlallen who wrote (136093)6/9/2004 6:28:55 PM
From: Maurice Winn  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
<I don't think we know the whole story as yet....and so far what I have seen qualifies as abuse but not torture....>

Gargle, gargle, rinse, spit.

You obviously have a weird idea of torture. Do you not understand that giving prisoners electric shocks is torture? The guy pleaded guilty. It is a fact.

Didn't you listen to your president and a LOT of other people who know the facts? You would not consider beating and electric-shocking American prisoners torture? It's okay to do to Americans what Americans did to others? Okay, let's go. Back to the stone age.

Mqurice



To: jlallen who wrote (136093)6/9/2004 10:06:08 PM
From: Sarmad Y. Hermiz  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
>> I don't think we know the whole story as yet....and so far what I have seen qualifies as abuse but not torture....
<<

Mowhoush, 57, died during interrogation Nov. 26 at Qaim, Iraq. The military has said Mowhoush died from asphyxiation due to smothering and chest compression. The CIA said one of its agents may have been involved and referred the case to the Justice Department for investigation.

wkrc.com

Local Soldier Investigated
LAST UPDATE: 5/28/2004 5:43:14 PM
An Army soldier based at Fort Carson declined
comment Friday on a report that he is under investigation in the
death of an Iraqi general during interrogation by U.S. forces last
fall.
``There is an agenda going on and I am not going to be caught up in it,'' Chief Warrant Officer Lewis Welshofer told The Associated Press in a brief telephone interview. ``I am not at liberty to discuss any of the details.''
Welshofer is married with three children and he grew up in
Middletown, Ohio, said his mother, Sarah Welshofer.
Welshofer and another officer are being investigated in the
death of Maj. Gen. Abed Hamed Mowhoush, who served in Saddam Hussein's military, The Denver Post reported Friday, citing Pentagon documents. The Post did not identify the other officer.
Mowhoush, 57, died during interrogation Nov. 26 at Qaim, Iraq.
The military has said Mowhoush died from asphyxiation due to
smothering and chest compression. The CIA said one of its agents
may have been involved and referred the case to the Justice
Department for investigation.
Welshofer and the other officer took over the interrogation and slid a sleeping bag over Mowhoush's head before rolling him from is back and to his stomach while asking questions, according to the documents reviewed by the Post.
Welshofer is accused of sitting on Mowhoush's chest and placing his hands over the general's mouth, the report says. Documents show both officers were reprimanded. The investigation for a possible court-martial continues, according to documents dated in early May.
Welshofer told the Post he had done nothing wrong while serving in Iraq. ``Absolutely not, I saved lives,'' he said.
Mowhoush was interrogated daily while in custody, according to the documents reviewed by the newspaper.
``Approximately 24 to 48 hours prior to (Nov. 26), MG Mowhoush was questioned by (other governmental agency officials), and statements suggest that MG Mowhoush was beaten during that interrogation,'' the summary reportedly said.
Investigators are looking into whether ``Other Governmental
Agency'' employees beat Mowhoush days before his death, according to the Pentagon documents. A CIA spokeswoman declined to comment.
Officials at Fort Carson, where Welshofer is based, have
confirmed some of their troops are being questioned in connection
with alleged mistreatment of Iraqi prisoners.



To: jlallen who wrote (136093)6/9/2004 10:12:55 PM
From: Sarmad Y. Hermiz  Respond to of 281500
 
>> and so far what I have seen qualifies as abuse but not torture....

sure, unless you want to count choking to death as torture.
But don't worry. The honorable US military will find another nice word for it. Like "natural causes". As in someone sitting on your chest and putting his hand over your mouth being defined as natural causes.

Beyond the interrogation deaths, the military documents show that investigators are examining other abuse cases involving soldiers using choking techniques during interrogations, including the handling of prisoners at a detention facility in Samarra, Iraq, where soldiers allegedly "forced into asphyxiation numerous detainees."

* On Nov. 4, an Iraqi died at Abu Ghraib during an interview by special forces and Navy SEAL soldiers. "An autopsy revealed the cause of death was blunt force trauma as complicated by compromised respiration." The report notes that Navy investigators concluded Navy personnel did not commit a crime leading to the detainee's death. But the investigation, including by CIA officials, is ongoing.


sltrib.com

Probe looks at suspicious prison deaths


By Miles Moffeit
The Denver Post


Miles Moffeit Brutal interrogation techniques by U.S. military personnel are being investigated in connection with the deaths of at least five Iraqi prisoners in war-zone detention camps, Pentagon documents obtained this week by The Denver Post show.
The deaths include the killing in November of a high-level Iraqi general who was shoved into a sleeping bag and suffocated, according to the Pentagon report. The documents contradict an earlier Defense Department statement that said the general died "of natural causes" during an interrogation. Pentagon officials declined to comment on the new disclosure.
Another Iraqi military officer, records show, was asphyxiated after being gagged, his hands tied to the top of his cell door. Another detainee died "while undergoing stress technique interrogation," involving smothering and "chest compressions," according to the documents.
Details of the death investigations, involving at least four different detention facilities including the Abu Ghraib prison, provide the clearest view yet into war-zone interrogation rooms, where intelligence soldiers and other personnel have sometimes used lethal tactics to try to coax secrets from prisoners, including choking off detainees' airways. Other abusive strategies involve sitting on prisoners or bending them into uncomfortable positions, records show.
Internal records obtained by The Post point to wider problems beyond the Abu Ghraib prison, and demonstrate that some coercive tactics used at Abu Ghraib prison have shown up in interrogations elsewhere in the war effort. The documents also show more than twice as many allegations of detainee abuse -- 75 -- are being investigated by the military than previously known. Twenty-seven of the abuse cases involve deaths; at least eight are believed to be homicides.
Beyond the interrogation deaths, the military documents show that investigators are examining other abuse cases involving soldiers using choking techniques during interrogations, including the handling of prisoners at a detention facility in Samarra, Iraq, where soldiers allegedly "forced into asphyxiation numerous detainees."
Pentagon officials, asked to comment on synopses of the cases provided by The Post, released a statement saying they do not discuss ongoing probes. "Make no mistake; we will take whatever corrective actions are determined to be appropriate," the statement said. "The offenders will be dealt with, and action will be taken to prevent such situations from happening again."
Tuesday, The New York Times reported that an American officer who led interrogations at the prison acknowledged that intelligence personnel sometimes instructed military police to mete out abuse.
In the case of Iraqi Maj. Gen. Abed Hamed Mowhoush, who headed Saddam Hussein's air force, the role of intelligence officers in abuse that soon turned fatal was documented.
Mowhoush, considered a "high-priority target," turned himself in for questioning in November, according to documents. After two weeks in custody at an Al Qaim detention facility, two soldiers with the 66th Military Intelligence Company placed a sleeping bag over his body, except for his feet, and began questioning him as they rolled him from his back to his stomach, the documents show.
Then, one of the soldiers, an interrogator, sat on Mowhoush's chest and placed his hands over the prisoner's mouth, according to the report: "During this interrogation, the [general] became nonresponsive, medics were called and he was later pronounced dead."
According to the documents, "The preliminary report lists the cause of death as asphyxia due to smothering and chest compressions." Immediately after Mowhoush's death was reported, U.S. military officials released a statement acknowledging he died during an interview.
"Mowhoush said he didn't feel well and subsequently lost consciousness," read the press statement, which is still posted on a Pentagon Web site. "The soldier questioning him found no pulse, then conducted CPR and called for medical authorities. According to the on-site surgeon, it appeared Mowhouse died of natural causes."
Criminal punishments apparently have not been pursued in the other interrogation-death cases, which also are ongoing.
Other prisoner deaths under homicide investigation, records show, include:
* The beating in early April of a detainee at the LSA Diamondback facility in Mosul, Iraq, who was found dead in his sleep. A death report showed "blunt-force trauma to the torso and positional asphyxia."
No disciplinary action was noted in the report but the investigation continues, the report states.
* Last June, at a "classified interrogation facility" in Baghdad, an Iraqi detainee was found dead after being restrained in a chair for questioning. "While in custody the detainee was subjected to both physical and psychological stress," the report shows. An autopsy determined that he died of a "hard, fast blow" to the head. The investigation continues. No disciplinary action was noted.
* On Nov. 4, an Iraqi died at Abu Ghraib during an interview by special forces and Navy SEAL soldiers. "An autopsy revealed the cause of death was blunt force trauma as complicated by compromised respiration." The report notes that Navy investigators concluded Navy personnel did not commit a crime leading to the detainee's death. But the investigation, including by CIA officials, is ongoing.