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To: JohnM who wrote (49948)	6/11/2004 4:01:37 AM
From: LindyBill	Respond to of 793955

But I do believe that we have forgotten the poor in urban ghettos, which is largely a black and hispanic population; that we all suffer from that forgetfulness; and that the most obvious lever to address that is public school education. That gives us a good starting point. Within that "Urban ghetto" grouping, I think immigrant blacks do much better than locals. They are achieving well in the same system that the local blacks are failing in. If I am right, that means it is do to the immigrant family values. I am looking for inquiries on this subject. I am sure they have been done. Glad you woke up in time again. :>)

To: JohnM who wrote (49948)	6/11/2004 4:06:38 AM
From: LindyBill	Respond to of 793955

The full meaningful quote is "the historical legacy of deep racism in the country." I used that phrase to cover slavery, Jim Crow, the equivalents in the north, etc. By the by, how did the Mexicans, et al, get folded into this? They certainly were not subject to this. And if this is the problem, why are blacks in Urban Ghettos doing so much worse today re education and family life than they were doing 50 years ago? They are certainly 50 years further from the problems of the past.

To: JohnM who wrote (49948)	6/11/2004 11:58:00 AM
From: Dennis O'Bell	Respond to of 793955

I forget whether it was James Baldwin or someone else who wrote that he preferred the American south, this was in in the 60s, because the racism was open. You at least understood where you were with folk. That's my feeling about the Hatred Of America today. But I do believe that we have forgotten the poor in urban ghettos, which is largely a black and hispanic population; that we all suffer from that forgetfulness; and that the most obvious lever to address that is public school education. Out of sight, out of mind has always been a source of problems further on down the line. Strengthening the public school systems serving problem areas is vital, but the problem is very complicated and is not the only problem these communities face, even if it's one of the most important. And many things like foot dragging bureaucracy, self interested labor unions, etc, complicate the matter a lot, but are not the primary source of the problems in themselves. They're good for finger pointing exercises though.

To: JohnM who wrote (49948)	6/13/2004 11:15:17 AM
From: greenspirit	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793955

res- But I do believe that we have forgotten the poor in urban ghettos, which is largely a black and hispanic population; that we all suffer from that forgetfulness; and that the most obvious lever to address that is public school education. John, I grew up in those "ghetto's" (Washington D.C.) and I can tell you far too many public schools are broke and have been broke for decades. The problem is not that we have forgotten public education as it relates to poverty, the problem is we have far too many people wedded to an ideology, who have prevented systemic improvements from taking hold in government education, thereby, allowing the cycle of ignorance to be perpetuated which is the single biggest factor in poverty.