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Politics : TRIAL OF SADDAM HUSSEIN -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (365)	7/6/2004 2:07:24 AM
From: marek_wojna	Respond to of 493

<<Of course he was. That's standard practice to get a nation and its military ready for war. The Japanese and Germans were demonized during WW2 too>> Germans and Japanese STARTED the war. Now the US started the war. How many victors you can count during last century who started the war and won?

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (365)	7/6/2004 10:13:58 AM
From: Richnorth	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 493

Saddam is an old man and does not look particularly well. No doubt, the stress of facing a trial will age him faster and might cause his health to deteriorate quickly perhaps to the point where he would be considered to be unfit to stand trial. Then what? Then again, if Saddam has something to reveal that would be very damaging and embarrassing to the US, some secret deal might be struck with him and the trial might assume a different course.................. ............................................... By the way, a judge at the International Court at the Hague is probably considering to let Milosevic walk away. Milosevic's health could end trial By Anthony Deutsch, Associated Press THE HAGUE, Netherlands -- Slobodan Milosevic's defense case was postponed Monday for a third time because of his poor health, prompting judges to review whether his trial on charges of war crimes and genocide could go forward. A medical report read in court said the 62-year-old former Yugoslav president has suffered damage to his heart from the stress of defending himself. Even after a four-month break in hearings and a shortening of his trial schedule, Milosevic's blood pressure was still at dangerously high levels, the report said. Facing repeated trial delays, prosecutors again pressed the court to impose defense counsel on Milosevic, who has insisted on representing himself since the trial began in February 2002. "The trial chamber is clearly of the view that the time has come for a radical review of the trial process and the continuation of the trial in light of the health problems of the accused," presiding Judge Patrick Robinson said. A ruling on the motion was expected within a few days. The court has dismissed such motions in the past, saying the defendant's right to represent himself was more important than a speedy trial. Milosevic angrily rejected the proposal. "It is out of the question as you know, nor will I ever agree to it," he said. Milosevic appeared relaxed, vigorous and fit in the courtroom, and objected when Robinson began discussing his medical file although he was overruled. Nevertheless, Milosevic accused the judges of ordering him to appear Monday, despite a doctor's report earlier in the day that he should remain at the nearby U.N. detention center to rest. The trial was to have resumed June 8 after a four-month break at the conclusion of the prosecution case. Prosecutors questioned nearly 300 witnesses and introduced a large number of documents, videos and other evidence. The three-judge panel that sat Monday included a new judge, Lord Bonomy, who replaced the previous senior judge, Richard May of Britain, who died last week. Milosevic had been preparing his defense against 66 war crimes counts in his indictment, stemming from the Balkan wars of the 1990s. His chief Belgrade lawyer, Zdenco Tomanovic, said Milosevic missed 51 working days of his preparation because of illness and was not ready or healthy enough to conduct his defense. Steven Kay, an independent lawyer appointed to monitor the fairness of the proceedings, said the court should consider the possibility that Milosevic may be too ill to stand trial. "It's been quite clear over the last five months that his health has been gradually declining," Kay told the court. "Two issues are arising at this stage: one is the fitness of the accused to present his defense case at this time and secondly his fitness to stand trial at all." According to the doctor's report submitted Friday, Milosevic has suffered "organ damage" due to high blood pressure, including "hypertrophy of the left ventricle," meaning an enlargement of the main pumping chamber of the heart. At times of stress, Milosevic's blood pressure rises to 200/130, and falls to around 140/80 when he is relaxed, said the report read by presiding judge Patrick Robinson. The first number reflects blood pressure as the heart beats, the second is the pressure between beats. A normal reading is 120/80 or less. Trial watchers said the court was likely to appoint a defense lawyer -- despite Milosevic's objections. "The court is finally facing up to the fact that if they want to see a conclusion to this ... they are going to have to take some serious measures, and that includes the appointment of counsel," Judith Armatta of the Coalition for International Justice said. Such a ruling would be a severe setback for the former Yugoslav strongman, who still has a wide following in Serbia and whose courtroom polemics have won him renewed popularity at home, nearly four years after he was toppled from power by a popular revolt. If a lawyer is appointed, the first question he would likely raise would be whether Milosevic was able to stand trial, Armatta said. Experts say the court would have no alternative but to free Milosevic if he is found unfit and the case is halted. Milosevic had been scheduled to give a four-hour opening statement, then begin calling witnesses. He has submitted a list of 1,400 names of potential witnesses, but will only have 150 days to present his case -- the same number of days as the prosecution. Milosevic challenges the authority of the court and repeated Monday he believes the trial is political. He denies wrongdoing but refused to enter a plea. A plea of not guilty was entered on hfor him. oaklandtribune.com

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (365)	7/6/2004 11:15:42 AM
From: Richnorth	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 493

Of course he was. That's standard practice to get a nation and its military ready for war. The Japanese and Germans were demonized during WW2 too. So do you think we should have stayed out and let Hitler have Europe and the Japanese Asia for that reason? I think you misunderstood me somewhat. You see, far too many naively accept what the media tells them as the gospel truth. I simply took the position that very often there's more than what meets the eye. To illustrate: many Americans to this day still believe the attack by the Japanese at Pearl Harbor ("Day of Infamy") was an unprovoked and cowardly attack simply because President Roosevelt said it was so. However, it appears that Japan, an emerging power in the Asia-Pacific sphere that other powers wanted to emasculate, Japan felt it was being unfairly treated, in Machiavellian ways, by America in regard to imports of vital raw materials. So, it was not surprising that, with Germany as an ally, the Japanese attacked a la the German blitzkrieg style. Fortunately for the Americans, the Japanese secret code was broken with the result that the US always knew what the enemy was up to. Yet Roosevelt let the attack take place so as to be able to galvanize full national support for war. You wanted to know whether I really believe that the Bushies bribed some Arabs to do their 9/11 episode? To be sure, there are pros and cons for what seems to be an outrageous idea. Well, as I said earlier, there's usually more than what meets the eye. So, let's wait for history to show where the chips fall. For now, Michael Moore of Fahrenheit 9/11 fame will give you quite an earful and eyeful. What's really amazing is that SH almost cooperated in the process. Now THAT is puzzling. Did he really ever think he had a chance against the US military? Or did his own military lie to him about its capabilities, possibly out of fear of him? My take is that Saddam was overly intoxicated with power and aggrandized by his henchmen and people. He was euphoric in his self-appointed role as the only tough Arab who dared stand up to the might of the US, and he told his Arab brothers elsewhere that attacks on Iraq were inevitable and a price to "pay for Muslim Renaissance". As he was fawned over by the US in the early 1980s and the western media exaggerated his power (btw, this was really part of a ploy to get him) Saddam loved to (or thus made) to believe he was invincible. This coupled with the fact that the UN would not cooperate with the US and Britain in regard to Iraq, no doubt, convinced him there would be no war. And so he strutted and strutted and enjoyed seeing everyone running circles around him. Of course, one must not forget he has enemies and traitors who betrayed him, notably Chalabi. As for Germany and Japan in World War II, as they were the ones that started the war, defence was not an option. War against them was fully justified regardless of whether there was demonization or not,of these countries. I brought out this demonization thing simply because lots of folks naively swallow the media's output hook-line-and-sinker like country yokels and become what Marx and Lenin called, "useful idiots" (i.e. useful to the goals of the perps.)