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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Ilaine who wrote (140855)	7/18/2004 11:39:08 PM
From: Sig	Respond to of 281500

<<"In the context of the ideas bin Laden shares with his brethren, the military actions of al Qaeda and its allies are acts of war, not terrorism; they are part of a defensive jihad sanctioned by the revealed word of God, as contained in the Koran, and the sayings and traditions of the Prophet Mohammed, the Sunnah. Bin Laden is out to drastically alter U.S. and Western policies toward the Islamic world. He is a practical warrior, not an apocalyptic terrorist in search of Armageddon.">> At the moment he may be riding a donkey high in the mountains which does put him closer to Allah than most of us. Perhaps Allahs word will finally get through clearly to him, telling him to keep his Ass moving before the Marines and Afghans shoot it out from under him. Sig

To: Ilaine who wrote (140855)	7/19/2004 12:58:42 AM
From: Nadine Carroll	Respond to of 281500

Edit: I think maybe I get the point you were making - he talks about "defense" and "U.S. and Western policies towards the Islamic world," without recognizing that Bin Laden wants to take jihad to the west for the sake of Islam. Aggression, not defense. In which case, getting out of Saudi Arabia, even throwing Israel to the wolves, wouldn't be enough. Yes, he talks about it being a religious war, even quotes bin Laden on it, without realizing what a religious war implies - that the policy issues are besides the point to bin Laden. They might be germane to the point how much popular support bin Laden can get, but to bin Laden & his followers there are mere symptoms of the real problem - that Islam is not on top anymore like Allah says it should be. And if that's what's driving him, minor or even major policy changes aren't going to change his mind, but only show weakness and encourage him.

To: Ilaine who wrote (140855)	7/19/2004 1:45:40 AM
From: dumbmoney	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

In which case, getting out of Saudi Arabia, even throwing Israel to the wolves, wouldn't be enough. Couldn't hurt.

To: Ilaine who wrote (140855)	7/19/2004 7:58:24 AM
From: skinowski	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Lenin was fighting for the working class. Bin Laden is fighting for Allah, for a new caliphate. Both are best understood as professional revolutionaries. Like Lenin, Osama bin Laden cannot achieve his goals without first capturing political power. He will interpret anything we do - or anything we fail to do - in light of his Jihad. The only thing which will please him, is victory. The problem is that his "victory" would be a great defeat for us - as well as for most Muslims... not entirely unlike Lenin's victory, which ushered in decades of most tragic times for the Russians.