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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (195571)	7/23/2004 2:19:44 PM
From: tejek	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1571691

The bottom line is that this appeal to emotion proves nothing. It's an attack on the person, and it has nothing to do with proving whether the war in Iraq is just or not. I disagree emphatically. There was a time when the American upper class was expected to join in a war. Granted they would not be the grunts but rather the officers.......nonetheless they were expected to participate. Somewhere along the line, noblesse oblige became the predominate theme......we'll start the wars and you guys will fight them for us. By doing that and getting away with it, we have loss a key part of our democracy. We stopped sharing the bad times; just the good times. And that was not the intent of our FF. Our FF did not like the class structure in Europe.....that's why there is much less emphasis on class here than there. Its one of the many elements that has helped make this country a great one. Therefore, I admire MM for embarrassing our lawmakers in that way. They deserve it. If there family and friends were jeopardized by the declaration of war with Iraq, they would think twice before making that declaration. Unfortunately, the way its set up now, they could make that declaration and watch the war on the tube as a form of entertainment........with the real price for that war paid by the middle or lower classes. If you really understood how the elite in this country view us.......the middle classes......you would get very angry in a heartbeat. ted

To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (195571)	7/23/2004 4:21:45 PM
From: Alighieri	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 1571691

OK...let's get back to basics...here's what you said that set me off... I know, Al, to you it's all about the "issues." This from a guy who would support William Hung singing his way into the White House, as long as he isn't Bush. Tenchusatsu OK...I am telling you for the last time that this is STUPID. Millions of people around the nation resent the fact that this president has taken this country to war on choice and has done tremendous damage to the fight on terror in the process. No burning buildings, firefighters, no whatever other crap you want to throw in there to confuse the issue. We are talking about war. Killing people for a presumed purpose where there is no other choice. That purpose seemed VERY wrong to me from the start, and I am being proven right. I have been absolutely consistent in my belief that this war could and should have been avoided. Today, no WMDs, no terror connections, no mushroom clouds, no imminent danger and a fantastic mess. If I could go back and rehash many of my posts you'd find exactly that, before it happened. Now stay with me, ok? When a war of choice is fought with someone other than your (used generically) kids, one tends to be more cavalier about the justification for that war...particularly if one is being partisan. That's the point that breaks the contract for me with this president. Among other attributes that suck about him are his fiscal policies, his faith in your face attitude, his disdain (at least during his first three non election years) for international treaties, the environmental neglect, ignoring the Palestine problem, alienating long time allies, and, last but not least, his entourage of neo shit heads who are chiefly responsible for much of this mess...and I didn't think very hard. So given a choice, I will take a Harley riding, snowboarding, guitar playing kerry to bush. I like much of the things he says, I like very little of what bush says. Is he a perfect candidate? No. In fact, I like Edwards better. But he is the VP and such is life. I don't like william hung, not even nader, whose ideas (some of them) I could embrace, but who could not win nor govern. So quit the self pity posts about ABB...they are vapid and baseless...smack dab in the heart of a conservative stereotype. Al

To: Tenchusatsu who wrote (195571)	7/23/2004 4:31:19 PM
From: Alighieri	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 1571691

Just in case you thought that bush was above politics and didn't listen to polls...can you believe this shameless guy? Al ======================================= Bush Says: 'I Want to Be the Peace President' Tue Jul 20, 2004 08:32 PM ET Printer Friendly \| Email Article \| Reprints \| RSS (Page 1 of 2) By Adam Entous CEDAR RAPIDS, Iowa (Reuters) - After launching two wars, President Bush said on Tuesday he wanted to be a "peace president" and took swipes at his Democratic rivals for being lawyers and weak on defense. With polls showing public support for the war in Iraq in decline, Bush cast himself as a reluctant warrior and assured Americans they were "safer" as he campaigned in the battleground states of Iowa and Missouri against Democrat John Kerry and his running mate, former trial lawyer John Edwards. "The enemy declared war on us," Bush told a re-election rally in Cedar Rapids. "Nobody wants to be the war president. I want to be the peace president... The next four years will be peaceful years." Bush used the words "peace" or "peaceful" a total of 20 times. Bush has called himself a "war president" in leading the United States in a battle against terrorism brought about by the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on America. "I'm a war president. I make decisions here in the Oval Office in foreign policy matters with war on my mind," he said in February. Despite a surge in attacks in Iraq and U.S. warnings that al Qaeda is plotting another major strike, Bush said U.S.-led wars in Afghanistan and Iraq had already made America safer, and that his re-election would let him finish the job. Ahead of the release of a report detailing the breakdown in intelligence and security before the Sept. 11 attacks, Bush said, "We reorganized this government of ours to be better protect the people." "For a while we were marching to war. Now we're marching to peace. ... America is a safer place. Four more years and America will be safer and the world will be more peaceful," Bush said. But a few hours later, at an evening rally in St. Charles, Missouri, Bush warned "the world will drift toward tragedy" if America shows "weakness." Bush was joined on the stump by his twin daughters, Jenna and Barbara, and campaign spokesman Scott Stanzel said the twins would pair up for campaign appearances away from their father starting Tuesday night in Missouri, Ohio and Pennsylvania. Stanzel said the events will be closed to the press. Bush and Kerry are fighting hard in Iowa, which Bush lost to Democrat Al Gore in 2000 by just 4,144 votes, or roughly two votes for every precinct. Recent polls give Kerry a narrow lead, but a Kerry aide said the Iowa race and the one in Missouri remain a dead heat. Bush won Missouri by 3 percentage points in 2000, and acknowledged in St. Charles that it would be a tough race this year. Continued ...