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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: cirrus who wrote (61674)	8/19/2004 5:32:20 PM
From: Ilaine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793955

Thurlow says that the WashPost isn't quoting him, it's quoting the same source that awarded Kerry the medal. Probably Kerry himself. Same language, same everything. Statement By Swift Boat Veterans for Truth Member Larry Thurlow I am convinced that the language used in my citation for a Bronze Star was language taken directly from John Kerry's report which falsely described the action on the Bay Hap River as action that saw small arms fire and automatic weapons fire from both banks of the river. To this day, I can say without a doubt in my mind, along with other accounts from my shipmates-there was no hostile enemy fire directed at my boat or at any of the five boats operating on the river that day. I submitted no paperwork for a medal nor did I file an after action report describing the incident. To my knowledge, John Kerry was the only officer who filed a report describing his version of the incidents that occurred on the river that day. It was not until I had left the Navy-approximately three months after I left the service-that I was notified that I was to receive a citation for my actions on that day. I believed then as I believe now that I received my Bronze Star for my efforts to rescue the injured crewmen from swift boat number three and to conduct damage control to prevent that boat from sinking. My boat and several other swift boats went to the aid of our fellow swift boat sailors whose craft was adrift and taking on water. We provided immediate rescue and damage control to prevent boat three from sinking and to offer immediate protection and comfort to the injured crew. After the mine exploded, leaving swift boat three dead in the water, John Kerry's boat, which was on the opposite side of the river, fled the scene. US Army Special Forces officer Jim Rassmann, who was on Kerry's boat at the time, fell off the boat and into the water. Kerry's boat returned several minutes later-under no hail of enemy gunfire-to retrieve Rassmann from the river only seconds before another boat was going to pick him up. Kerry campaign spokespersons have conflicting accounts of this incident-the latest one being that Kerry's boat did leave but only briefly and returned under withering enemy fire to rescue Mr. Rassmann. However, none of the other boats on the river that day reported enemy fire nor was anyone wounded by small arms action. The only damage on that day was done to boat three-a result of the underwater mine. None of the other swift boats received damage from enemy gunfire. And in a new development, Kerry campaign officials are now finally acknowledging that while Kerry's boat left the scene, none of the other boats on the river ever left the damaged swift boat. This is a direct contradiction to previous accounts made by Jim Rassmann in the Oregonian newspaper and a direct contradiction to the "No Man Left Behind" theme during the Democratic National Convention. These ever changing accounts of the Bay Hap River incident by Kerry campaign officials leave me asking one question. If no one ever left the scene of the Bay Hap River incident, how could anyone be left behind? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Statement by Navy Veteran Van Odell, Swift Boat Veterans for Truth in Rebuttal to Michael Dobbs, Washington Post, August 19, 2004 A courageous, soft spoken man of the Midwest, Larry Thurlow has a heart bigger than the great plains and a commitment to truth and honesty that is boundless. He is under attack, because John Kerry is feeling the heat of truth at the hands of this honest man and others like him. The Kerry Campaign is attacking the truthfulness of this man and the Bronze Star he so richly deserves for his actions on March 13, 1969. I was there. I saw what happened. The mine's detonation lifted PCF-3 completely out of the water just yards ahead of me. All boats commenced suppression fire in case enemy small arms fire ensued. None did. All boats came to the aid of PCF-3, except one: John Kerry's boat. Kerry fled. Larry Thurlow piloted his boat straight toward the mine-damaged PCF-3 from which thick, black smoke billowed. He jumped aboard and personally led damage control operations that saved the boat and rescue operations that saved the lives of badly wounded men. Larry's leadership was in the highest traditions of the naval service. His leadership allowed the other men and boats of the mission to exit the river safely. This single act of meritorious service -- the chief requirement of the Bronze Star -- should be honored, not ridiculed, by the Kerry campaign and its allies in the mainstream media. To reiterate, only one enemy weapon was deployed that day -- the command-detonated submerged mine that disabled PCF-3. Larry Thurlow's citation contained references to "enemy small arms and automatic weapons fire," because that was the language chosen by John Kerry who penned the spot report on the action that day. There was no "enemy small arms and automatic weapons fire" received that day. John Kerry's report was fiction -- a hoax on the entire chain of command. Larry Thurlow's heroism and meritorious service, however, is real. To me Larry is one of the heroes of our country. He is a man who served his country when called and who returned home to be a productive citizen. Larry and men like him are the strong backbone of our society. I am proud to have served with him. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Below is a statement from John O'Neill responding to Senator John Kerry's August 19, 2004, attack on The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. Mr. O'Neill is the author of Unfit for Command. ----- The Navy did not send Republicans or Democrats to the island of An Thoi. We are responding and dealing with something that is deeply personal - our own record and the record of our unit in Vietnam. These are issues Senator Kerry raised and we regret that he uses ad hominem attacks instead of dealing with the actual facts. He is doing that because he can't deal with the truth. For example, for 35 years he said he claimed that one of the turning points of his life was spending Christmas Eve and Christmas illegally in Cambodia, libeling our commanders and our nation with accusations of war crimes. That is a totally false statement because he was no where near Cambodia on Christmas Eve and Christmas day. The Kerry campaign continues to flip flop on the Cambodia issue. In addition, Senator Kerry closed the Democratic National Convention with a story in which he claimed that five of the boats fled on March 13 after a mine went off and he came back. His campaign is now admitting that he fled and the rest stayed. Attacking our organization does not respond to the facts that occurred in Vietnam. Senator Kerry says that he has learned to charge into an ambush in connection with this, instead he is fleeing down the river from the facts. swiftvets.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I agree that so long after the fact, it's hard to tell the players without a scorecard, which is why I've ordered the book, apparently that makes it easier to follow.

To: cirrus who wrote (61674)	8/19/2004 6:41:34 PM
From: Andrew N. Cothran	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 793955

To be quite frank, cirrus. I haven't read the Thurlow story yet. But that's not the real point with me. The real point is that MccAuliffe and his hatchet men over at the DNC spent months egging their media lackeys and other undesirable types, including MoveOn and George Soros with his millions of dollars to go after George Bush tooth and nail, calling him a liar, accusing him of being AWOL and egging on the press and tv and other lap dogs who to recommence an attack just like the one they conducted back in the year 2000. That long Roman circus over a total and complete non-issue, George Bush's National Guard service, had already been beat to death back in the 2000 Gore-Bush confrontation. That attack, along with the famous TV ad sponsored by the NAACP and aided and abetted by the DNC implying that Bush was involved in the chain dragging and beheading of the black in Texas, including a reenactment of the dragging scene. Now talk about a low. That, my friend was a new low, much lower than anything yet to appear in this year's campaign. So, when the 250 Swift Boat Vets come along, what do they get and announce a press conference to address their grievances with the official Kerry Vietnam line. Total silence from the media. So they arrange their own financing (not from Soros) but from others including a few Texans but so what. In no way could Perry match Soros. They get their tv ad out and then all hell breaks loose. Its as if the DNC and now Kerry himself think that they have been attacked by idiots and nincompoops who are nothing but disappointed cry babies and other undesirable types including child molesters. When the DNC and now Kerry found out that they could no longer sweep the Swift Vets under the rug as so much trash, they then started their current campaign to discredit them and convince the country that the Swift Vets are no better than the town drunk and other white trash. A famous Clinton tactic. Furthermore, the Swift Vets are under the command of George Bush himself who is in charge of their unfair campaign of vilification. BULL SHIT! How dishonest can the DNC be. And "Bring It On" Kerry? Did he think that he was entitled to a free and unchallenged ride all the way from one of his Boston multi-million dollar houses (owned by Heinze Heine herself ) all the way to the White House. Yea, man, Bring It Own. Bring on James Carville, Lanny Davis, the Washington Post, the New York Times, The Los Angeles Times, et al. Its about time that we discovered a level playing field so that this battle can continue until the November vote. So my version of Truth does not differ much from millions of other versions. And those who think that we are wrong and they are right will continue to shout, as is their right. The Dems think that Lanny Davis can shout down the Viet Vets as he tried to do a few nights ago on the Fox network. What the Dems don't know, however, is that cry babies attract a lot of attention but barely every win the brass circle or get the golden ring. So Bring It Own. All's fair in politics as long as one side recognizes that the other side has access to the same tactics, the same information, the same truths however conceived and believed, and the same bully horn to broadcast their message to the same American public. It is not that the one that shouts the loudest wins. It is that the one who convinces the most Americans of the rightness and correctness of his cause and does so with honesty and vigor: that, my friend, is the one who will win. And I trust the wisdom of the American people to be able to see through the smoke and the mirrors into the heart of the matter. They shall know the truth and the truth will go with them into the ballot box. And that truth will keep the free--at least free of the grasp of Kerry, his Massachusetts buddies, and other types who continue to believe that government rightfully belongs to them and others of the favored establishment and not to the great unwashed. Bring It Own.