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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: LindyBill who wrote (62632)8/22/2004 7:45:47 AM
From: LindyBill  Respond to of 793806
 
Congressional logrolling. Very interesting.

Atlantic Blog - Who gets what
One of the annoying features of much popular discussion of environmentalism is the pretense that it is a conflict between business and the environment. There is a conflict over the ways resources are used, but those conflicts can show up in a variety of subtle ways. For example, it has long been known that Robert Byrd's attachment to mandatory emission control equipment on coal burning, of the sort in the 1977 Clean Air Act, is a way to protect the coal industry in West Virginia. It produces soft coal, which needs lots of scrubbers to clean up. Hard coal from the west does not need as much equipment. The Act required all the technology to be used, eliminating the cost advantage of hard coal.

In the same vein, the Chicago Tribune (registration required) carries an unusually insightful piece on road building in national forest areas, noting reasonably carefully who gains and who loses (link courtesy of an old college friend).

Mark Woodall is an unlikely environmentalist. After all, he makes his living growing trees so he can cut them down.

But Woodall and other small tree farmers are aligning themselves with the Sierra Club and other "green" groups as the White House proceeds with its plan to open roadless forests to commercial logging.

While they care about the earth, Woodall and his counterparts care about their livelihoods too.

They're expecting to get aced out of the big government contracts by the timber, oil and gas goliaths. And if that happens, the ensuing lumber glut means lower prices for the little guys.

"It's bad for the environment and bad for the pocketbooks of the tree farmer," said Woodall, who grows about 6,000 acres of trees near LaGrange in west Georgia.

. . .

Although the decision affects more than 30 percent of national forests, the more than 700,000 acres in Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina, North Carolina, Tennessee and Virginia are a relatively small portion compared with the huge tracts in the West.

Those forests are worrisome to farmers such as Woodall, who has enjoyed the rising price of sawtimber pinewood over the last 15 years. Prices now reach almost $40 a ton.

"The restrictions doubled our prices, so if you went back it could cut our prices in half," he said. "A 50 percent cut in our paycheck could not be good."

The story notes the explicit alliance between the environmentalist groups and the small loggers.
The Southern Environmental Law Center, which has offices in Atlanta, Chapel Hill, N.C. and Charlottesville, Va., and similar groups are hoping to harness the power of concerned loggers before the two-month comment period on the roadless restrictions ends Sept. 14.
Opening up western forests to road building would benefit the foresters working in the west, of course, but there is another beneficiary: people who buy wood at lower prices. There are a lot of wood buyers in those southern states (population numbers here). The six southern states mentioned in the story have a combined population of about 39 million. Many of the heavily forested western states have tiny populations (Montana, Wyoming, and Idaho average less than a million people each). So a cut in wood prices provides a small benefit to those western states, but a very large benefit to those six southern states. The Tribune offers this comment from a forester.
"I think here in the South all the governors we've talked to have said this could be bad for the economy down here," said Woodall, a member of the Sierra Club.
Actually, it could be quite good for the economy, because buyers there would gain a lot. If wood purchases in those states exceed wood sales (which the article suggests is certainly the case), the gain to buyers would substantially exceed the loss to southern loggers. But southern loggers and environmentalists are small, well organized voting blocks, whereas wood buyers are a vast and badly organized group.



To: LindyBill who wrote (62632)8/22/2004 7:54:19 AM
From: LindyBill  Respond to of 793806
 
Strange Days
Belmont Club

A Newsweek article describes the festival-like atmosphere within the area surrounded by US troops in Najaf.

"Townspeople make their way to the mosque at all hours, night and day, for prayers and companionship. They generally seem calm and comfortable, even when —the shelling outside is heavy. At night, festoons of colored lights cast a carnival glow on the men who stand and chat in the mosque's vast courtyard. During the day—between gun battles, anyway—the place almost resembles a big cookout, when huge stew pots are set up in the rubble outside the south gate beneath a canopy of fallen electrical lines, and plates of rice with tomato sauce are served to all comers. ...

At times the insurgents act as if the siege is practically a street party. One afternoon I met a dozen or so guerrillas a few blocks from the shrine, racing east through the deserted neighborhood toward the U.S. line. The group's leader, just out of his teens and built like a wrestler, was running barefoot, apparently not bothered by the shrapnel that covered the pavement. He said his name was Ali; he and his men had traveled from the far northern city of Mosul to join al-Sadr's revolt. They were going to attack an American armored vehicle. Almost within sight of their target, they were greeted by other pro-Sadr fighters from Nasiriya and Karbala. The youngest of the group, spotting a poster of al-Sadr on a nearby wall, asked me to photograph him with it. At that, the whole bunch broke into a wild dance, bouncing and chanting: "Moqtada! Moqtada!" Then mortars began hammering the area, and I left for safer ground. I haven't seen Ali since."

A strange sort of festival where the lights and faucets work and men fire from positions lit by colored lights. The fighting at Najaf isn't just a military operation, it's an event: a scene. Scott Baldauf of the Christian Science Monitor, who organized a convoy into the Ali shrine on August 20, when it seemed likely that it would be assaulted was surprised to find acquaintances from Baghdad when he got there:

Inside the shrine itself, there were no weapons to be seen, but there were hundreds of Mahdi Army supporters, some of them familiar faces from a demonstration one week ago in Baghdad. They were voluntary human shields, the youngest perhaps 8 years old, the oldest 70. Together, they marched around and chanted, turning an impromptu press photo op into a punk rock mosh pit.

We were led around to the north side of the shrine and into an air-conditioned office, where al-Sadr's spokesmen, Sheikh Ali Smeisim, gave a news conference. Smeisim's statement was a complete reversal of what we had been told. He said that al-Sadr had accepted all of the conditions of the National Conference delegation, although he was unable to meet the delegation in person because of concerns for his safety.

The political conditions under which the campaign against Sadr is being conducted has created scenarios that have no parallel in military history bar none, and quite possibly, since the world began. Rice and sauce served to all comers beside field hospitals; chanting punctuated by heavy machine firing; extreme vitality juxtaposed with death. Here is camaraderie souped up with adrenaline and fame, where the difference between momentary celebrity as the object of interest of a Newsweek reporter and the cold silence of the tomb are the seconds it takes for an 81 mm mortar round to arc over a thousand yards. The gulf between Moqtada Al Sadr's boys and the followers of Grand Ayatollah Sistani may in the end be wider than Koranic learning. It is generational. Sadr, a young man still in his thirties, has provided that magnetic, almost irresistible draw: a place for young people where something is happening. He sets up the situation, America provides the music and the rave begins. 'I tell ya, I wuz there man', in Arabic, casts the same spell it does for youth the world over. The strange thing is that the Marine teenagers on the other side will be writing the same lines, in English, to their parents and friends back home, where in exact symmetry their elders are debating Najaf not in terms of the Koran, as Sistani's adherents are wont, but through the prism of riverine actions in Vietnam thirty five years ago, and congratulate themselves for being more scientific.

Yet the present has a way of destroying the past. Critics who accuse President Bush of widening the war by pursuing Sadr often forget that wars widen both ways. It would be equally valid to say that Iran has widened the war against Iraq by keeping the pot simmering in Najaf. Sadr, as the bellweather of Teheran, has as much as declared a steel cage death match with Prime Minister Allawie. Those who accuse President Bush of living in the past often do so as ghostly voices from the mists of the Mekong Delta. The party which started on September 11 can return to America or it can finish up in Teheran. The one that happened in Vietnam ended a long time ago.

But it's too late to say you're sorry
How would I know, why should I care
Please don't bother tryin' to find her
She's not there

Well let me tell you 'bout the way she looked
The way she'd act and the color of her hair
Her voice was soft and cool
Her eyes were clear and bright
But she's not there
The Zombies



To: LindyBill who wrote (62632)8/22/2004 8:18:16 AM
From: unclewest  Respond to of 793806
 
We are all concentrated on this issue, and it has become so big for us that we are seeing it out of proportion to the way the rest of the country sees it.

I use my rear view mirrors everyday.

One of murphy's rules of combat says, "When the going gets easy look out, you are walking into an ambush."

That is what happened to Kerry.

This is one battle. There will be more.



To: LindyBill who wrote (62632)8/22/2004 11:23:36 AM
From: Nadine Carroll  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 793806
 
We are all concentrated on this issue, and it has become so big for us that we are seeing it out of proportion to the way the rest of the country sees it.


If Kerry's numbers slide in the next two weeks, the ads will have had an effect; if not, not. That's the reality check I'm waiting for.



To: LindyBill who wrote (62632)8/22/2004 2:30:11 PM
From: KLP  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 793806
 
The voters who were born after 1950 don't know much about the Vietnam War firsthand...and certainly not the ones born after 1960... For many, hearing Kerry actually say the words he said to the Senate 1971, while we were at war and our soldiers were still fighting, and being captured, and dying....has got to make an impact. It certainly will to any young Military folks who are fighting right now, and to their families who are sacrificing while they are gone.

Kerry's credibility, or lack thereof, is important. He talks of what he whodda, shoulda, coulda, done....but all we can see is what he has done. He evidently needed his awards so badly he put requests in for them. So be it.

Now, maybe the Vietnam POW's who are still living, after being tortured by the NV directly because of words from Kerry, will be heard. Of course, those who died can't talk. But the living will remind us of who they were, and how they died.