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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: unclewest who wrote (62664)	8/22/2004 10:26:31 AM
From: John Carragher	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 793841

per this morning talk show swiftboat vets are getting daily over $20,000 in donations.

To: unclewest who wrote (62664)	8/22/2004 10:27:44 AM
From: gamesmistress	Respond to of 793841

Now THIS would be a great ad: August 21, 2004 I Attempt A Swift Ad If the Swiftee's new ad can excerpt Kerry's 1971 testimony, mine can too. And we will juxtapose Kerry's 2004 acceptance speech: 2004: I'm John Kerry, and I'm reporting for duty. 1971: I would like to talk, representing all those veterans, and say that several months ago in Detroit, we had an investigation at which over 150 honorably discharged and many very highly decorated veterans testified to war crimes committed in Southeast Asia, not isolated incidents but crimes committed on a day-to-day basis with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command. 2004: I am accompanied by an extraordinary band of brothers led by that American hero, a patriot called Max Cleland. Our band of brothers doesn't march together because of who we are as veterans, but because of what we learned as soldiers. We fought for this nation because we loved it, and we came back with the deep belief that every day is extra. We may be a little older, we may be a little grayer, but we still know how to fight for our country. 1971: …they had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, tape wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the country side of South Vietnam… 2004: I know what kids go through when they're carrying an M-16 in a dangerous place, and they can't tell friend from foe. I know what they go through when they're out on patrol at night and they don't know what's coming around the next bend. I know what it's like to write letters home telling your family that everything's all right, when you're not sure that that's true. 1971: I would like to talk to you a little bit about what the result is of the feelings these men carry with them after coming back from Vietnam. The country doesn't know it yet, but it has created a monster, a monster in the form of millions of men who have been taught to deal and to trade in violence, and who are given the chance to die for the biggest nothing in history; men who have returned with a sense of anger and a sense of betrayal which no one has yet grasped. 2004: I learned a lot about these values on that gunboat patrolling the Mekong Delta with Americans -- you saw them -- who come from places as different as Iowa and Oregon, Arkansas, Florida, California. No one cared where we went to school. No one cared about our race or our backgrounds. We were literally all in the same boat. We looked out, one for the other, and we still do. 1971: …we are ashamed of and hated what we were called on to do in Southeast Asia. 2004: I defended this country as a young man… 1971: In our opinion, and from our experience, there is nothing in South Vietnam, nothing which could happen that realistically threatens the United States of America. justoneminute.typepad.com

To: unclewest who wrote (62664)	8/22/2004 12:06:14 PM
From: Andrew N. Cothran	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 793841

"Kerry made a huge mistake by focusing attention of what he did 35 years ago when he was 25 years old. What he has lost is far greater than anything he has gained." I agree with your post, unclewest. The campaign is not yet over. But the Democratic candidate is, as you say, severely wounded. It is interesting that Kerry and the DNC are today involved in their own version of the Battle of the Bulge. They are attempting to stanch the continuing heavy flow of blood caused by the first and the second Swift Boat ads. They are desperate to get them banned from the airwaves. Their battle of the bulge is apparent. And it is apparent that Kerry and the DNC and the MoveOn Soros crowd are losing. To fully comprehend their current dismay and disorientation, all one has to do is to look at the latest poll of Veterans who plan to vote. Kerry has lost an amazing percentage of points while Bush has not only has held his own but has gathered in all of those veterans' votes that Kerry has lost and is losing. [According to CNN (unfair and unbalanced) the latest poll of Veterans is Bush 55% and Kerry 37%. Watch Kerry continue to slide.] The would-be-commander-in-chief, with his famous cry "Bring IT OWN!" was in reality saying HELP!! Now that cry of HELP is getting louder and louder. And all of the liberal media, from the New York Times on up, are rallying to Kerry's cause. Note that these "completely unfair and unbalanced" sources of opinion shunned the Swift Boat Veterans as if they were confronting a political plague that had to be ignored. So they ignored them--including the Swift Boat's initial press conference, as if they were undeserving of any kind of attention. Then, when the SB's got traction, the NYT and their fellow travelers could no longer ignore what they were saying. The NYT resorted to its TRUE stripes . Today's front page demonstrates the phenomenon. The NYT has now emerged from behind its earlier pretensions. Now, it is all about our great hero, John Kerry, and those awful lying Americans, the Swift Boat contingent of the US NAVY, Kerry's contemptuous former colleagues. As you concluded, unclewest: "Maybe the third (Swift Boad Ad) will finish (Kerry) off. Like he finished off that wounded VC." Kerry robbed many of the Viet Vets of their pride of service. Now they are expressing their contempt for Kerry, a contempt well-earned. PS: I have read that Kerry was visibly shaken and deeply disturbed at his reception before the Veterans of Foreign Wars. Once again, Kerry reveals his complete lack of understanding of who he is, where he came from, where he is going, and what people think of him as he continues his bus trip across America's heartland. And Kerry expected better treatment at the Vet's Convention. The man is still suffering from delusions of political grandeur.

To: unclewest who wrote (62664)	11/16/2004 12:04:12 AM
From: Captain Jack	Respond to of 793841

A Vietnam Vet named Russ sent this poem. Interesting take on the role of the military in our society. The Sheepdogs Most humans truly are like sheep Wanting nothing more than peace to keep To graze, grow fat and raise their young, Sweet taste of clover on the tongue. Their lives serene upon Life’s farm, They sense no threat nor fear no harm. On verdant meadows, they forage free With naught to fear, with naught to flee. They pay their sheepdogs little heed For there is no threat; there is no need. To the flock, sheepdog’s are mysteries, Roaming watchful round the peripheries. These fang-toothed creatures bark, they roar With the fetid reek of the carnivore, Too like the wolf of legends told, To be amongst our docile fold. Who needs sheepdogs? What good are they? They have no use, not in this day. Lock them away, out of our sight We have no need of their fierce might. But sudden in their midst a beast Has come to kill, has come to feast The wolves attack; they give no warning Upon that calm September morning They slash and kill with frenzied glee Their passive helpless enemy Who had no clue the wolves were there Far roaming from their Eastern lair. Then from the carnage, from the rout, Comes the cry, “Turn the sheepdogs out!” Thus is our nature but too our plight To keep our dogs on leashes tight And live a life of illusive bliss Hearing not the beast, his growl, his hiss. Until he has us by the throat, We pay no heed; we take no note. Not until he strikes us at our core Will we unleash the Dogs of War Only having felt the wolf pack’s wrath Do we loose the sheepdogs on its path. And the wolves will learn what we’ve shown before; We love our sheep, we Dogs of War. Russ Vaughn 2d Bn, 327th Parachute Infantry Regiment 101st Airborne Division Vietnam 65-66