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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: michael97123 who wrote (147094)10/6/2004 10:47:05 AM
From: Suma  Respond to of 281500
 
Really think you are on the right track and agree with a lot of what you say here. Do you want specifics... I think overall it is what I believe... plus thinking that the current administration should stay in place to clean up the mess they have created.. which I don't think possible.

If they stay seated and the the world explodes with more terrorist attacks here... and abroad our allies will only turn against us more for having provoked the conflict without having solved it. I think the proposed elections are farcical given the current climate both in Iraq and Afghanistan..

AND the American electorate will perhaps wake up to the falsehoods being perpetrated on them.



To: michael97123 who wrote (147094)10/6/2004 12:03:33 PM
From: Dr. Id  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
I think that bush/cheney deserve to be praised for the way they handled 9/11 but fired over iraq-

So, in regard to Bush, you think he should be praised for the way he handled 9-11? So, sitting a reading (or pretending to read...still haven't seen evidence that he can read) My Pet Duck for 7 and a half minutes while the country is under attack, and then fleeing to Nebraska rather than returning immediately to Washington...you think that deserves praise?

Talk about lowering the bar!

As for the little bird in the back of your head...there is medication for that (but you won't be able to get it cheaper from Canada, thanks to Bush-Cheney)



To: michael97123 who wrote (147094)10/6/2004 12:05:09 PM
From: Dr. Id  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
I think that bush/cheney deserve to be praised for the way they handled 9/11 but fired over iraq-

So, in regard to Bush, you think he should be praised for the way he handled 9-11? So, sitting a reading (or pretending to read...still haven't seen evidence that he can read) My Pet Duck for 7 and a half minutes while the country is under attack, and then fleeing to Nebraska rather than returning immediately to Washington...you think that deserves praise?

Talk about lowering the bar!

And a little bird in the back of my head tells me that Bush/Cheney might better able to do what is necessary in a second term unfettered by any concerns pertaining to reelection

As for the little bird in the back of your head...there is medication for that (but you won't be able to get it cheaper from Canada, thanks to Bush-Cheney)

Beside, it is utterly frightening to think of what these guys will do "unfettered by any concerns pertaining to reelection". Kiss your civil liberties goodby...



To: michael97123 who wrote (147094)10/6/2004 3:26:11 PM
From: stockman_scott  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 281500
 
Big-City Editorials Rate the Debate, Give Slight Edge to Edwards

___________________________

By E&P Staff
Published: October 06, 2004 10:00 AM EDT
mediainfo.com

NEW YORK Wednesday morning's editorials in big-city papers on last night's vice presidential debate gave mixed marks to both Vice President Dick Cheney and Sen. John Edwards, with the verdict favoring Edwards somewhat but no one declaring a knockout punch by either man.

The Washington Post gave the North Carolina senator a slight edge. "The Democrat was more effective, and more on point, in challenging Mr. Cheney on rationales for the Iraq war that have proven false, in particular connections between Saddam Hussein and al Qaeda, and for the vice president's continuing failure to acknowledge the difficulties of the Iraq mission," The Post stated. "Mr. Cheney was as cutting as a school principal lecturing a delinquent student on the subject of Mr. Edwards's Senate 'attendance record.' But if the question was whether he has the grounding to assume the presidency if need be, Mr. Edwards delivered a solid performance on both foreign and domestic policy last night."

For USA Today, the contest seemed more of a draw, but editors noted Cheney's performance topped that of his boss. "While the foreign-policy disagreements were largely a replay of the first debate between Bush and John Kerry, Cheney's self-assured command of the facts made him more effective than Bush had been in delivering a similar message," the paper wrote. "Then, too, these are the men running for the No. 2 spot, not the presidency. Historically, what the public wants most in candidates for that office is, as Cheney noted, the sense that they'd be competent should they be forced to assume the presidency in crisis. By that measure, each man filled the bill -- though what the two would do with the office differs enormously."

At the Los Angeles Times, editors took a clear shot at Cheney and declared Edwards a competent winner. "As the evening wore on, Cheney's chin sank down his chest, his gravelly voice turned into an inarticulate rumble and he even started passing up opportunities to talk at all," he paper declared. "When Edwards, with that boyish smile that worked magic with jurors, stuck a knife in his gut (for example, about his role as CEO of Halliburton), Cheney more than once said he didn't know where to begin, and then didn't. Some of his own demagogic thrusts, meanwhile, were bizarre. Surely many GOP small businessmen were alarmed to hear the vice president denounce so-called S corporations (a common tax-favored setup apparently used by Edwards' law practice)."

The Arizona Republic scored one for the Veep. "Who won this debate is easy," it declared. "Cheney took command early and rarely let up. If the Republican strategy was to take the fight to the Democrats, Cheney followed the battle plan."

The San Francisco Chronicle gave both men points and rated the contest a tie. "If nothing else, Vice President Dick Cheney and Sen. John Edwards last night offered Americans a dramatic choice in style and substance. The only thing they seemed to have in common during the vice presidential debate was a disdain for each other. Unlike the Kerry-Bush debate, where the challenger clearly knocked the president out of his comfort zone, neither Cheney nor Edwards seemed overly ruffled by what were often extraordinarily hard shots at each other. Each stayed in character, for better and worse."

The New York Post waved its flag for Cheney: "John Edwards had his opportunity last night -- and muffed it. Not so Dick Cheney: Nothing hit home like his pointed observation on why the two Democrats first voted to commit U.S. troops -- to an operation they now claim was 'the wrong war at the wrong time' -- but then voted against providing those troops with the $87 billion worth of bombs, bullets and body armor that they needed."

But a certain other New York paper disagreed strongly with that. The New York Times declared that Cheney, "who won over many voters four years ago with his grandfatherly demeanor during a debate with Joseph Lieberman, seemed tired and angry. He was particularly dyspeptic when he responded to criticism of his relationship with Halliburton by claiming that Mr. Edwards had a bad attendance record in the Senate," the paper opined. "Mr. Edwards is normally known for his wide grin and boyish appearance, but he was serious and tough last night. If his main task was to show that he could stand up to the older and more experienced vice president, he did everything he needed to do, especially during the discussion of foreign policy -- the area that is supposed to be his weak suit."

The Boston Globe told its readers the debate was a close-call, with a slight edge for Edwards, but no major slam. "Vice President Dick Cheney could have come across as the Bush administration's hatchet man, too mean-spirited to deserve reelection, but he didn't," the Globe stated. "Senator John Edwards could have come across as young and inexperienced, too callow to serve a heartbeat from the Oval Office, but he didn't. ... The major result of last night's debate is that few if any voters will go out to elect or defeat Cheney or Edwards. The race is between Bush and Kerry, with a lot riding on their next two debates."

The Dallas Morning News, Denver Post, Charlotte Observer and Indianapolis Star all essentially called it a draw. The Denver paper declared: "The task last night for the vice presidential candidates was to make the men at the top of their tickets look like heroes and make their opponents look like they've been wearing flip-flops. Mission accomplished!" The Observer called it an even "slugfest."

Copyright 2004 Editor & Publisher




To: michael97123 who wrote (147094)10/6/2004 3:38:40 PM
From: Keith Feral  Respond to of 281500
 
Iraq is filled with terrorist group that call for the same jihad against Americans. Afghanistan was a complete joke. I think the regional balance of power is better with US troops backing a the new Iraqi government. I never believed WMD ere necessary to oust Saddam from power.

However, the Middle East is far better off because of the war. Oil prices have doubled from $25 to $50 a barrel. The Islamic terrorists also get to laugh at America as we sit back and criticize our leadership.