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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Grainne who wrote (90400)	12/2/2004 2:59:21 PM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

we can start here icrc.org and here icrc.org and here icrc.org They sure seem to be doing some great work. The ICRC's President, Jakob Kellenberger, has delivered a speech at the Nairobi Summit on a Mine Free World - I never even heard of this summit- nice to know they had it.

To: Grainne who wrote (90400)	12/2/2004 3:05:06 PM
From: Jagfan	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 108807

The International Red Cross is whining again about tactics used by the U.S. government at the Islamic Terrorist Detention Center down at Gitmo. By the way, the International Red Cross has nothing to do with the American Red Cross, so don't let this affect your contributions here at home. So what is the IRC complaining about? They say the Military is using psychological and physical coercion that is "tantamount to torture." I guess that means we're not allowed to make Islamic terrorists a little uncomfortable. The complaints include: loud and persistent noise and music, prolonged cold, and "some beatings." Beatings? Just what constitutes a "beating" to the IRC appeasers? All together now....awwwwww poor babies. The brutal truth is that if I, or, I suspect, if you had in your presence an Islamic terrorist that you knew had information on when and where the next terrorist attack on the United States would be, there is little you wouldn't do to get that information out of him. Maybe we need a sign at Guantanamo: "The beatings will stop when morale improves." We are at war with the most vicious enemy this country has ever known. Islamic terrorists have vowed to ensure our personal destruction so that they may enslave the world with their hateful ideology. If we want to win World War IV, we're going to have to do whatever it takes. Making some enemy combatants a little uncomfortable with hip hop music and an occasional spanking certainly qualifies. boortz.com It's time for a rational debate Linda Chavez (archive) The International Committee of the Red Cross has accused the United States of torturing enemy combatant prisoners at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, according to documents leaked to The New York Times this week. Does that mean U.S. interrogators are sticking needles under inmates' fingernails and attaching electrodes to sensitive body parts? Or are they merely beating prisoners senseless? Hardly. The ICRC report itself hasn't been made public, but a memorandum summarizing its contents describes far less egregious behavior. Among the tactics the ICRC portrayed as "tantamount to torture" were solitary confinement, temperature extremes, and using "forced positions" to obtain information from some of the approximately 500 men held at Guantanamo. What if one of these men had information that might prevent a nuclear attack on an American city? Would it be unthinkable to force him into uncomfortable physical positions? What about keeping him too warm or too cold in his cell, or blaring loud noises at him while he tries to sleep? Would it be immoral to make him fearful by playing on his phobias, or by depriving him of human contact for days or even months on end? Those are exactly the types of methods the ICRC describes as torture. The ICRC does not appear to have uncovered anything approaching real torture. But perhaps it's time we put aside our squeamishness on this issue and opened a genuine debate about exactly what methods a humane society is justified in using to save innocent lives. townhall.com

To: Grainne who wrote (90400)	12/2/2004 3:27:06 PM
From: Bill	Read Replies (5) \| Respond to of 108807

1. The ICRC is not the American Red Cross. The ICRC seeks prisoner comfort, no matter how barbaric or egregious the crime. And, according to the American Red Cross, the Guantanamo Bay prisoners may not even be covered under International Humanitarian Law, making the ICRC report, where ever it is, irrelevant. 2. You said, "a lot of innocent teenagers, passersby and noncombatants got mixed up in the sweep of people who ended up at Guantanamo." I think you're mixing up Abu Grahib with Guantanamo. The folks imprisoned in Gitmo are the worst of the worst, most having been captured on the battlefields of Afghanistan. Nobody was swept into Guantanamo. 3. You said, "America is one of the leading human rights abusing nations in the world." That's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen written on SI.