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Politics : Just the Facts, Ma'am: A Compendium of Liberal Fiction -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Suma who wrote (22417)	12/9/2004 10:03:56 AM
From: longnshort	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 90947

Suma, here's the rub, during Nam there was a DRAFT. Those guys running to Canada, volunteer. Why did they volunteer to join the army? to play Dodge ball?

To: Suma who wrote (22417)	12/9/2004 10:20:37 AM
From: Alan Smithee	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 90947

Suma, I'll reserve any judgment or comment on that until the fact checkers go through it. I view anything seeBS reports anymore with skepticism. Did you happen to Catch 60 Minutes last night ? 5000 young men have deserted the Armed services and fled to Canada. Reminiscent of the sixties. ... Viet Nam. I did not know this and I was surprised.

To: Suma who wrote (22417)	12/9/2004 10:25:54 AM
From: Lazarus_Long	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 90947

Desertion Desertion is the act of leaving military service, or a place of duty, without permission and with the intention not to return. It is the intention not to return that differentiates desertion from the less serious offense of absence from duty. Desertion has been the bane of virtually every organized military force throughout history, and few armies, from the most egalitarian to the most authoritarian, seem to be immune: it takes place in war and peace, in garrison and at the front. Given the sheer dimension of the phenomenon, desertions have unquestionably undermined the efficiency of military organizations. In Napoleonic France, deserters numbered hundreds of thousands: as many as half of the draftees from the Haute-Loire district could be expected to absent themselves from the army at the earliest opportunity. Similarly, in the first year and a half of the American Civil War,the Army of the Potomac alone had 85,000 desertions. However, the advent of peace brought no lessening of the number of desertions in the U.S. Army. To the contrary, the harsh conditions of peacetime service on the western frontier encouraged whole regiments to virtually evaporate: in 1867, desertions from George Custer's famous Seventh Cavalry Regiment reached 52 percent, and between 1867 and 1891, almost one-third of the troops discharged themselves. In more contemporary times, the practice continued, although at somewhat diminished rates. In World War II,the U.S. Army reported 40,000 deserters and the British Army over 100,000, the apparent discrepancy being accounted for by the more lenient American interpretation of "desertion" as opposed to mere absence without leave. The omnipresence of desertion suggests that the underlying causes vary. The fear of death or injury in battle is one obvious factor, but more widespread motives are likely to be less dramatic: simple discontent with military life, homesickness, boredom with garrison duty, personal or financial problems. Indeed, studies of British and American deserters in World War II indicate that soldiers who were less well adjusted as civilians were more likely to desert. Opportunity also plays a part. In the French Foreign Legion, desertion rates varied with locale: in Algeria the problem was less acute if only because there was no place to desert to. Weather can also be a consideration; in the post-Civil War American army, the nickname for a deserter was "snowbird," a reference to those soldiers who preferred to serve only through the winter, deserting in the spring when travel was easier and jobs in the mines or on the transcontinental railroad became available. college.hmco.com Or maybe there was just a lot more press coverage available recently than before. Or a press more bent towards covering anti-war activity. You can HARDLY claim that desertion was invented by the Viet vets or our current Army.

To: Suma who wrote (22417)	12/9/2004 12:05:22 PM
From: sandintoes	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 90947

I saw about three minutes of 60 minutes last night and thought, "here we go again...more lies and hate America drivel" Anyone who believes one thing 60 Minutes puts out deserves to stay uninformed forever. How hard is it to find one person who hates the military after they join and are told this is real, and you might get shot? You should be depressed about all the Viet Nam Vets your "wonderful young men " spit on when they returned home, and then had the courage to run to Canada so no one could spit back. You can blame your democratic Presidents for Viet Nam...they got us in, Nixon got us out! Abbie Hoffman, Jerry Rubin, Dave Dellinger, Rennie Davis, Tom Hayden, Lee Weiner, and John Froines-- The Chicago Seven were fine upstanding citizens, weren't they? How about the Black Panthers, all they wanted to do was kill the pigs (aka cops) Oh yes what fine young men you knew...it didn't take much to get some pot and burn your draft card, it took guts to pick up a gun and go to Viet Nam.