To: combjelly who wrote (72457 ) 2/16/2005 12:09:18 PM From: Oeconomicus Respond to of 89467 "One frequently cited misapprehension is that IBC "only can count deaths where journalists are present."[link] This is incorrect, and appears to arise from unfamiliarity with the variety of sources which the media may report and IBC has used. These sources include hospital and morgue officials giving totals for specific incidents or time periods, totals which in turn have sometimes been integrated into overall tolls of deaths and injuries for entire regions of Iraq as collated by central agencies such as the Iraqi Health Ministry (see KRT 25th September 2004 [link]); these are all carefully separated from more "direct" as well as duplicate media reporting before being added to IBC's database... Little-known but impeccably reported death tolls in fact constitute the larger part of IBC's numbers (as can be seen by sorting IBC's database by size of entry). We believe that such counts - when freely conducted and without official interference - have the potential to far exceed the accuracy and comprehensiveness even of local press reporting. It is after all the job of morgues and hospitals to maintain such records, and not the media's, who simply report their findings." iraqbodycount.net BTW, have you looked at their list of "some of our core sources"? Al Jazeera, Jordan Times, Commondreams.org, Human Rights Watch and a host of press and NGOs from around the world. Frankly, given the eagerness of the press in THIS country - never mind the Arab press, NGOs and world press - to pin as many deaths and injuries as possible on coalition forces and George Bush, I see NO reason to think that reported deaths significantly understate actual deaths and certainly not an 80,000 understatement. In fact, I'd say that it's an absurd notion that the real number could be higher by a factor of FIVE TIMES the actual reports. But you go on believing what you want to believe, regardless of the lack of real evidence. Some people are so eager to find "proof" that Bush and the US military are evil they will believe anything. Hell, there are people on this very thread - you may be one of them, but I don't know you, so I'll assume not for now - who are convinced that George Bush was behind - directly and literally - both 9/11 and the recent tsunami. Now that's nutty!